Todd Frazier Available

[LDF]

You're disagreeing with my point LDF. I am just saying it's only up from here for Rodon. Not saying they should trade him next year or in two years, but it would be a far better scenario than the one now.

 

ok i am still with you, but i am a little lost.

 

i do not want to trade rodon for the sake of trading him. and only will if the other team pays the ransom to get him. that is whether it is now, next yr or later.

 

now, there is no choice for the club but to trade someone and no one is exempt. imo

[LDF]

The thing about Kenny is outside of Gio (and maybe I'm forgetting someone else), he really rarely ever gave up a player who ever amounted to much anything. In many cases, you could make a point that when he sold his assets, he sold high. Olivo and Gio probably had the best careers out of that and Kenny did good when he sold Gio the first time (and when he got him back), but obviously failed when he moved him for Swisher. That was probably the worst trade in Kenny's history, which is pretty incredible given how many trades he actually made (and it isn't like Nick Swisher is a bum, yes he turned out not to be a fit and had a lousy year with the Sox but he's had a good career).

 

and you made a good point. here is another way to look at it. in those trade, even the other team some what believed that they were getting a quality player and that player failed to develop any further.

 

so the point is was it kw superior knowledge in the future or did he get lucky there.

second, the state of the system was even then horrible.

[Princess Dye]

Not in this CIN rumor, specifically......but if there ever were one point in the Yes Column for trading Rodon-- it's that his current contract will likely be his last with the Sox, since Boras will push him to free agency as much as he can (that is, if he isnt mediocre or worse).

 

And we dont tend to like to set the high end of the market as a favor to Boras, or for FA pitchers period

Edited December 15, 2015 by Jose Paniagua

[shysocks]

Daniel Hudson is worth mentioning. Wonder if he might have stayed healthy here.

[LDF]

Not in this CIN rumor, specifically......but if there ever were one point in the Yes Column for trading Rodon-- it's that his current contract will likely be his last with the Sox, since Boras will push him to free agency as much as he can (that is, if he isnt mediocre or worse).

 

that is part b of 3 parts that i have as a defense of trading rodon.

 

yes, the ability to a. bring him more in the rtn, b. knowing full well that the sox and any other org will not be able to sign him to an extension. and c, this if the chance is there, the sox can reap the most in the main rtn.

 

 

i hate to say this, but part of baseball is a business.

[Chisoxfn]

Chris Young too but you're right that that the group of prospects KW traded never really amounted to much as a whole

Good point on Young. That said, while he's been a serviceable player. He had those two years where you thought, oh crap, we gave up a star (when the Dbacks made that run) but than he regressed big time. All for Javy, who could never pitch to his talent.

[Chisoxfn]

Daniel Hudson is worth mentioning. Wonder if he might have stayed healthy here.

No idea but I can't mention Hudson since he really only had such a short lived bout of success. Now you could also say, he could have traded almost any position talent in the Sox org and they would have never amounted to anything (because we haven't had any meaningful position talent develop...within the org or that we dealt elsewhere) in, well, forever.

[Chisoxfn]

and you made a good point. here is another way to look at it. in those trade, even the other team some what believed that they were getting a quality player and that player failed to develop any further.

 

so the point is was it kw superior knowledge in the future or did he get lucky there.

second, the state of the system was even then horrible.

You know...the guy was GM for 10+ years. Hard for me to say he just got lucky that he never traded away a star. The players the Sox kept tended to be the ones who ended up being better (obviously pitchers).

[Princess Dye]

Bob Nightengale ‏@BNightengale 17s17 seconds ago

The Cincinnati #Reds drawing extensive interest from AL Central teams who want Todd Frazier:#Indians, #Whitesox, #Royals.Also #Dodgers in NL

[daggins]

Another Cinci plant? Or are the Indians upping their offer?

[Chisoxfn]

Royals would make sense as Frazier would add a bat who wouldn't be expensive ($ value wise). But with 3B not a need, I feel that giving up that cost for a guy who is so good because he plays that position and does it well, just doesn't make sense. As a LF'er, Frazier value, imo, is negated. Why not just find another outfielder or go after the guy the Braves got from the Dbacks (Alicdes or whatever his name is).

[ChiSoxFanMike]

Royals would make sense as Frazier would add a bat who wouldn't be expensive ($ value wise). But with 3B not a need, I feel that giving up that cost for a guy who is so good because he plays that position and does it well, just doesn't make sense. As a LF'er, Frazier value, imo, is negated. Why not just find another outfielder or go after the guy the Braves got from the Dbacks (Alicdes or whatever his name is).

Inciarte?

 

I'd love to get him.

[Chisoxfn]

Inciarte?

 

I'd love to get him.

Yep...that is it. Name was slipping me. Supposedly Braves are considering moving him for pitching.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

As much as I have enjoyed reading about the Royals and circumcisions, the talks with the Reds have completely cooled. The Sox don't fit what he Reds want. I think that's a good thing. For a lesser price, maybe Frazier makes sense, but this isn't going anywhere for now.

 

Jon Heyman tweeting yesterday was a Reds plant to drum up the market. Nothing to see there.

I'm fine and happy then. I'm not giving up Anderson or Fulmer. I bet Hahn chuckled when they asked about Rodon.

 

It was a Montas package all along and they want position players it sounds like unless they get an awesome pitching prospect.

[BlackSox13]

Inciarte?

 

I'd love to get him.

Im all aboard that train! Wonder what the cost would be?

[GGajewski18]

Inciarte?

 

I'd love to get him.

 

I would think Inciarte would revolve around Anderson as well. That kid is really good.

 

In regards to the Nightengale tweet, Reds have to be asking for Salazar or Frazier as a package. The Royals package would have to include Mondesi I'd assume. Would the Royals use Frazier for LF since they have Moose at 3B?

 

I'd be up for giving up Anderson for Frazier and another piece like Cozart or a B level prospect

[LDF]

You know...the guy was GM for 10+ years. Hard for me to say he just got lucky that he never traded away a star. The players the Sox kept tended to be the ones who ended up being better (obviously pitchers).

 

and in those 10 yrs, that gm screw up the system that it is still trying to fix.

 

in those 10 ys, they really never really drafted, back to back, rnd to rnd player who is worth anything to write about.

 

and in those 10 yrs, those player did not get any better, thereby proving my point, he did not draft worth a damn

[Chisoxfn]

and in those 10 yrs, that gm screw up the system that it is still trying to fix.

 

in those 10 ys, they really never really drafted, back to back, rnd to rnd player who is worth anything to write about.

 

and in those 10 yrs, those player did not get any better, thereby proving my point, he did not draft worth a damn

Your point was whether he got lucky in that he never traded away good players. I argued he wasn't lucky. The discussion wasn't about whether he drafted well. We all know the Sox org has sucked from a player development perspective. That really isn't much of a debate.

[LDF]

Your point was whether he got lucky in that he never traded away good players. I argued he wasn't lucky. The discussion wasn't about whether he drafted well. We all know the Sox org has sucked from a player development perspective. That really isn't much of a debate.

 

but before that player development, they will need the players. whether if it is thru drafting or now int't signings.

 

btw, how big was that int'l scheme in those 10 yrs of kw

[Baron]

Inciarte is going to cost you more than Anderson to get

[kevo880]

Rosenthal's latest blurb:

 

http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/price-h...osenthal-121515

 

"WHY WHITE SOX MIGHT BALK AT FRAZIER

 

Frazier certainly is a fit at third base and in the middle of the lineup for the White Sox; newly acquired Brett Lawrie could move to second, giving the Sox upgrades at two positions.

 

The problem is, the Reds want significant prospects for two years of Frazier, and the White Sox's system remains relatively thin. Better the team should explore the open market -- if it can find the right solution.

 

A free agent such as second baseman Howie Kendrick would cost the Sox a second-round draft pick; their first-round pick, No. 10 overall, is protected. But Kendrick also has turned down $15.8 million from the Dodgers, and at 32 soon could enter his decline phase.

 

Third baseman David Freese might make more sense -- he probably would be more affordable than Kendrick and the Angels did not make him a qualifying offer, removing the additional cost of a pick."

[southsider2k5]

Daniel Hudson is worth mentioning. Wonder if he might have stayed healthy here.

 

With the emphasis that the Sox put on pitching mechanics, I would bet the expectation of an injury very well could have played a part in his being traded.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Rosenthal's latest blurb:

 

http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/price-h...osenthal-121515

 

"WHY WHITE SOX MIGHT BALK AT FRAZIER

 

Frazier certainly is a fit at third base and in the middle of the lineup for the White Sox; newly acquired Brett Lawrie could move to second, giving the Sox upgrades at two positions.

 

The problem is, the Reds want significant prospects for two years of Frazier, and the White Sox's system remains relatively thin. Better the team should explore the open market -- if it can find the right solution.

 

A free agent such as second baseman Howie Kendrick would cost the Sox a second-round draft pick; their first-round pick, No. 10 overall, is protected. But Kendrick also has turned down $15.8 million from the Dodgers, and at 32 soon could enter his decline phase.

 

Third baseman David Freese might make more sense -- he probably would be more affordable than Kendrick and the Angels did not make him a qualifying offer, removing the additional cost of a pick."

 

I'm thinking the Freese scenario is most likely. Sign Freese and Cespedes, keep draft picks and prospects.

[LDF]

I'm thinking the Freese scenario is most likely. Sign Freese and Cespedes, keep draft picks and prospects.

 

that will work much better and that could be a good 2nd option.

[BlackSox13]

I'm thinking the Freese scenario is most likely. Sign Freese and Cespedes, keep draft picks and prospects.

Agreed. IMHO, this scenario makes the most sense. The Sox upgrade both offensively and defensively while keeping picks and prospects.