ESPN's Buster Olney...White Sox All In

[caulfield12]

http://espn.go.com/blog/buster-olney/insider/post?id=11898

 

The first part of the story is here....headline story on the ESPN MLB page for now.

 

Interesting (but unsurprising) how many teams have been hoping the White Sox would be open to trading Sale this offseason.

 

Now where's the final piece of the puzzle, JR?

 

 

Next fall, the best free-agent pitchers could be Stephen Strasburg, Brett Anderson and Jered Weaver, and the best position players figure to be a 31-year-old Carlos Gomez and a 33-year-old Martin Prado, and perhaps Jose Bautista. An NL executive offered a one-word description of the depth of next year's free-agent class: "Horrific."

 

From the Olney piece three days ago about why CLE is being patient in dealing Carrasco or Salazar.

 

Edited December 21, 2015 by caulfield12

[reiks12]

Next year's offseason will be terribly boring from the free agent side. Hopefully we will still be too busy celebrating the 2016 world series championship to care.

[caulfield12]

Amen to that.

 

Peace with the two warring sides of SoxTalk (or KW/HahnGate) as well...at least until about two or three months into the following offseason.

[ChiSox59]

Despite what the White Sox beat writers say, the White Sox are very much willing to give up the QO. I said and Hayes told me highly doubts it but now Nightengale and Olney have said it.

 

For Gordon or Upton...fine.

 

For Fowler or Desmond...i hope not.

[Lip Man 1]

If the Sox truly are "All In.." let's hope like hell it turns out better than the last two times they took this approach (2011 and 2015). I mean they couldn't fall flat on their faces a third straight time could they?

 

Mark

[LDF]

If the Sox truly are "All In.." let's hope like hell it turns out better than the last two times they took this approach (2011 and 2015). I mean they couldn't fall flat on their faces a third straight time could they?

 

Mark

 

if they take short cuts, yes.

[OnlyGillis]

http://espn.go.com/blog/buster-olney/insider/post?id=11898

 

The first part of the story is here....headline story on the ESPN MLB page for now.

 

Interesting (but unsurprising) how many teams have been hoping the White Sox would be open to trading Sale this offseason.

 

Now where's the final piece of the puzzle, JR?

 

 

Next fall, the best free-agent pitchers could be Stephen Strasburg, Brett Anderson and Jered Weaver, and the best position players figure to be a 31-year-old Carlos Gomez and a 33-year-old Martin Prado, and perhaps Jose Bautista. An NL executive offered a one-word description of the depth of next year's free-agent class: "Horrific."

 

From the Olney piece three days ago about why CLE is being patient in dealing Carrasco or Salazar.

 

 

 

A lot of turkeys available on Thanksgiving.

[Lillian]

Given the dearth of talent that will be available over the next two free agent classes, why not sign several players, with the idea that they could be trade pieces, to contending teams, desperate for key players, in 2017 and 2018? Sure the payroll would sky rocket this year, but the chances to win go way up, and then the front office could dump payroll and acquire top prospects, the following two years. They would be holding a lot of supply into a very limited market, with the normal demand bidding up the price for players. Trades will necessarily become the only viable means of acquiring players, which means that teams, which want to contend will have to be willing to give up prospects.

 

Go ahead Mr. Reinsdorf, knock yourself out. Sign two outfielders, a right handed starting pitcher, and maybe even a SS. Back load the contracts as much as possible. Have a big 80TH birthday bash, and then let Hahn open the "store" for business, after the World Series. Oh, and La Roche. What to do with him? Who cares?

Edited December 26, 2015 by Lillian

[caulfield12]

That's all fine and good, but we haven't had much luck since the Dunn signing pulling off this feat, or you can go back to Rios and Peavy.

 

Jake might have had the most disappointing career overall with the Sox, but ironically he fetched us the most talent back of anyone. Actually, when they announced their resigning him, it seemed a bit nuts but it worked out fine.

 

Just looking at everyone we brought in last year, the only player we could currently trade without eating any salary would be Robertson.

 

This kind of "hoarding talent" type of strategy would work better for a rebuilding team with all their minor league talent at least 2-3 seasons away from being ready. With the White Sox, anything you get for Frazier, Lawrie, Cabrera is likely to be Avi Garcia type talent with flaws...but the hardest problem to resolve is selling "high" on players who are performing well when the team's contending. See Shark last July after the Blue Jays series.

 

In the past, we held onto Crede and Jenks too long, not to mention Quentin, Ramirez, Floyd, Danks, Crain, Humber, Thornton. Also, you're looking at budgetary constraints...playing time issues...just look at all the surplus talent the Dodgers acquired the last 2-3 years and what they have to show for it all now. And that's a team spending 2.5x what the White Sox do.

 

As it is, we're going to be 15-20% over projected budget adding one of the Big 3 (theoretically). Finally, it would make more sense to stockpile young, cost-controlled talent than veterans with a negative WAR roi unless you can hit on the perfect Tier Three veterans and flip them like Epstein has done 2-3 times in rebuilding the Cubs.

Edited December 26, 2015 by caulfield12

[LDF]

Given the dearth of talent that will be available over the next two free agent classes, why not sign several players, with the idea that they could be trade pieces, to contending teams, desperate for key players, in 2017 and 2018? Sure the payroll would sky rocket this year, but the chances to win go way up, and then the front office could dump payroll and acquire top prospects, the following two years. They would be holding a lot of supply into a very limited market, with the normal demand bidding up the price for players. Trades will necessarily become the only viable means of acquiring players, which means that teams, which want to contend will have to be willing to give up prospects.

 

Go ahead Mr. Reinsdorf, knock yourself out. Sign two outfielders, a right handed starting pitcher, and maybe even a SS. Back load the contracts as much as possible. Have a big 80TH birthday bash, and then let Hahn open the "store" for business, after the World Series. Oh, and La Roche. What to do with him? Who cares?

 

i am in agreement with some of what you mention. i have been among those who have express that this is the time to sign fa's.... to put the pieces on the team, all the while continue to build up the farm system. pay not, where it is front loading or back loading, the contract. but the main point is to get those players and maybe by chance, the org can pull a rabbit and can be extremely competitive ....

 

either way, the new faces on the team and the talent they bring will make next yr team exciting.

[LDF]

That's all fine and good, but we haven't had much luck since the Dunn signing pulling off this feat, or you can go back to Rios and Peavy.

 

Jake might have had the most disappointing career overall with the Sox, but ironically he fetched us the most talent back of anyone. Actually, when they announced their resigning him, it seemed a bit nuts but it worked out fine.

 

Just looking at everyone we brought in last year, the only player we could currently trade without eating any salary would be Robertson.

 

This kind of "hoarding talent" type of strategy would work better for a rebuilding team with all their minor league talent at least 2-3 seasons away from being ready. With the White Sox, anything you get for Frazier, Lawrie, Cabrera is likely to be Avi Garcia type talent with flaws...but the hardest problem to resolve is selling "high" on players who are performing well when the team's contending. See Shark last July after the Blue Jays series.

 

In the past, we held onto Crede and Jenks too long, not to mention Quentin, Ramirez, Floyd, Danks, Crain, Humber, Thornton. Also, you're looking at budgetary constraints...playing time issues...just look at all the surplus talent the Dodgers acquired the last 2-3 years and what they have to show for it all now. And that's a team spending 2.5x what the White Sox do.

 

As it is, we're going to be 15-20% over projected budget adding one of the Big 3 (theoretically). Finally, it would make more sense to stockpile young, cost-controlled talent than veterans with a negative WAR roi unless you can hit on the perfect Tier Three veterans and flip them like Epstein has done 2-3 times in rebuilding the Cubs.

 

nice post, i really like the bold, "hoarding talent" . with the new faces, i am or would suggest that the sox get as many draft picks, to draft the best players they can. to develop them and hoard them.... the price of fa's has gone crazy and the sox can not go into that ring and go toe to toe with the big money teams..... spend this yr and sit it out and let the farm system build itself.

[Lillian]

That's all fine and good, but we haven't had much luck since the Dunn signing pulling off this feat, or you can go back to Rios and Peavy.

 

Jake might have had the most disappointing career overall with the Sox, but ironically he fetched us the most talent back of anyone. Actually, when they announced their resigning him, it seemed a bit nuts but it worked out fine.

 

Just looking at everyone we brought in last year, the only player we could currently trade without eating any salary would be Robertson.

 

This kind of "hoarding talent" type of strategy would work better for a rebuilding team with all their minor league talent at least 2-3 seasons away from being ready. With the White Sox, anything you get for Frazier, Lawrie, Cabrera is likely to be Avi Garcia type talent with flaws...but the hardest problem to resolve is selling "high" on players who are performing well when the team's contending. See Shark last July after the Blue Jays series.

 

In the past, we held onto Crede and Jenks too long, not to mention Quentin, Ramirez, Floyd, Danks, Crain, Humber, Thornton. Also, you're looking at budgetary constraints...playing time issues...just look at all the surplus talent the Dodgers acquired the last 2-3 years and what they have to show for it all now. And that's a team spending 2.5x what the White Sox do.

 

As it is, we're going to be 15-20% over projected budget adding one of the Big 3 (theoretically). Finally, it would make more sense to stockpile young, cost-controlled talent than veterans with a negative WAR roi unless you can hit on the perfect Tier Three veterans and flip them like Epstein has done 2-3 times in rebuilding the Cubs.

 

Well, perhaps the Sox are not the right organization to do it, but some team may try to exploit this circumstance by "hoarding talent," as you put it.

[LDF]

Well, perhaps the Sox are not the right organization to do it, but some team may try to exploit this circumstance by "hoarding talent," as you put it.

you may have a point, on initial impression, but the sox can do it. here is a perfect scenario.... get an additional sp. go with 5 sp's. keep ej and use him as a swing pitcher, a long relief. ease him in and let him get his feet wet. just grooming him for a bigger role in 17. in 17 do the same with fulmer if need to.

 

that is the best way to use the resources available, hoarding talent and using them in the most judicious way possible. working from a superior position.