White Sox interested in SS Ian Desmond

[Thad Bosley]

Me too .I was one of the few who tried to say all his inconsistency , OBP and work ethic was overblown by his less than humble nature , the backlash that always comes when discussing a polarizing player, and the fact his numbers with RISP was fantastic and OBP wasn't much of a necessity when a guy makes habit of driving in big runs. I also spoke of combining him and Abreu to form the Cuban Connection and make the Cell a big fiesta when they started really rolling. You can't buy that kind of publicity and it would draw attention to the Sox like nothing else could have.

It was absolutely a no-brainer to have brought Cespedes in, for exactly the reasons you stated. And yet we were outbid by the Madoff-challenged Mets to do so. This was a colossal failure for this front office, to be sure. And now we find ourselves in discussions about the free agent market leftovers, guys like Fowler, who is a table scrap from the Cubs made expendable by them because they DID acquire a premium available outfielder this offseason. Fowler, this year's Melky Cabrera: decent hitter, sub par defender. That sound like Cespedes to you?

[OmarComing25]

It was absolutely a no-brainer to have brought Cespedes in, for exactly the reasons you stated. And yet we were outbid by the Madoff-challenged Mets to do so. This was a colossal failure for this front office, to be sure. And now we find ourselves in discussions about the free agent market leftovers, guys like Fowler, who is a table scrap from the Cubs made expendable by them because they DID acquire a premium available outfielder this offseason. Fowler, this year's Melky Cabrera: decent hitter, sub par defender. That sound like Cespedes to you?

So would you have paid Cespedes $30 million this year? Because that's the minimum it would have taken to pry him away from the Mets. And I'm still not sure that would have been enough.

[Thad Bosley]

So would you have paid Cespedes $30 million this year? Because that's the minimum it would have taken to pry him away from the Mets. And I'm still not sure that would have been enough.

Would I pay him $30M a year? No, but only because I didn't win that PowerBall from a couple of weeks ago; otherwise, I might have been tempted!!

 

Would I be ok with Jerry Reinsdorf digging into his coffeiurs and outbidding the Mets of all teams, who are in far greater financial dire straits than the Sox, for the services of Cespedes? Oh, you betcha! You betcha. We currently have a modest payroll at best, so bringing in Cespedes would not have broken the bank.

 

Meanwhile, Cespedes would have put us in a far greater position to compete next year and return to the postseason. Instead, we still have the two sub-par players manning the OF corners, and now the discussions are focusing on bringing in guys like Fowler and Jackson, who aren't much better than the incumbents themselves. Big time, missed opportunity this week by the geniuses in the front office, the same guys who brought us Cabrera and Avi to begin with.

[southsider2k5]

So would you have paid Cespedes $30 million this year? Because that's the minimum it would have taken to pry him away from the Mets. And I'm still not sure that would have been enough.

 

Honestly, I am not even sure that would have been enough.

[103 mph screwball]

Sign Desmond on a buy low. Trade top prospects for the best cost controlled right fielder available. Hope for some health, career years, and a another World Series trophy. Keep Avi and take at shot at fixing his hitting and have him learn first base for the future after Laroche.

[OmarComing25]

Would I pay him $30M a year? No, but only because I didn't win that PowerBall from a couple of weeks ago; otherwise, I might have been tempted!!

 

Would I be ok with Jerry Reinsdorf digging into his coffeiurs and outbidding the Mets of all teams, who are in far greater financial dire straits than the Sox, for the services of Cespedes? Oh, you betcha! You betcha. We currently have a modest payroll at best, so bringing in Cespedes would not have broken the bank.

 

Meanwhile, Cespedes would have put us in a far greater position to compete next year and return to the postseason. Instead, we still have the two sub-par players manning the OF corners, and now the discussions are focusing on bringing in guys like Fowler and Jackson, who aren't much better than the incumbents themselves. Big time, missed opportunity this week by the geniuses in the front office, the same guys who brought us Cabrera and Avi to begin with.

So you're mad at ownership for not paying Cespedes more money than every other position player in the league?

[spiderman]

What did the per year averages end up being, in the so-called buyers market, for the top remaining offensive talent?

[bmags]

Heyward - like 25.5 (if you consider the 3 years and all signing bonus money even if its deferred)

Cespedes - 25

Gordon - 18

Upton - 22

 

Basically a shade under what everyone is expecting with big shocker being years.

 

I have no sympathy for the comments like "so you want them to pay X $25 million per YEAR?!?!". No, I didn't , but when they rely on Free Agency to acquire talent and claim to want to compete right way, that they actually engage that market with realistic expectations of cost. None of these guys are "overpaid", they are paid what top level free agent outfielders will continue to get.

[OmarComing25]

Heyward - like 25.5 (if you consider the 3 years and all signing bonus money even if its deferred)

Cespedes - 25

Gordon - 18

Upton - 22

 

Basically a shade under what everyone is expecting with big shocker being years.

 

I have no sympathy for the comments like "so you want them to pay X $25 million per YEAR?!?!". No, I didn't , but when they rely on Free Agency to acquire talent and claim to want to compete right way, that they actually engage that market with realistic expectations of cost. None of these guys are "overpaid", they are paid what top level free agent outfielders will continue to get.

I would agree with you if Gordon had signed with the Angels and Cespedes had signed with the Orioles. But 2 of the Big 3 stayed with their original teams, and the third reportedly had no interest in coming here. It wasn't a case of being unwilling to pay what they ultimately got paid, because we would have had to significantly outbid the other offers to have a chance. According to reports both Gordon and Cespedes had higher offers on the table, who says the Sox didn't bid more on both of them? If that was the case it seems like the Sox were well aware of the cost needed to acquire them, but it wasn't going to be enough to get them.

[Y2Jimmy0]

I saw on twitter that Desmond is projected for 3 zWAR next season with 21 homers by the ZIPS projection.

[hogan873]

I saw on twitter that Desmond is projected for 3 zWAR next season with 21 homers by the ZIPS projection.

Someone had noted the other day that adding Desmond would give the Sox an infield that could easily produce 100 HRs. If he could be added cheap (and I mean CHEAP), he could be worth the lost draft pick.

[harfman77]

I don't see how anyone can dog the Sox for not signing him. 27.5 million a year for him is ridiculous. Especially being if he has a good year he's gone, if he has a decent year he is probably gone. The only way he stays is if he sucks. Then we are on the hook for 42.5 over 2 years. Then the ones that are b****ing and moaning now (not saying anyone here) will be the ones that are b****ing and moaning over a bad contract having 21.5 million tied up in 1 guy that flopped completely.

 

It's like teachers with snow days... complain when they have to go to school when it snows, complain more when they have to make up days at the end of the year.

 

I am not going to "dog" them for not getting Cespedes, its pretty clear he wanted to go back to the Mets. But giving up a pick for a declining middle infielder with poor defense is just a bad move to make. Just because they missed on one guy doesn't mean they should make a move like this just for the sake of making a move.

[Y2Jimmy0]

I am not going to "dog" them for not getting Cespedes, its pretty clear he wanted to go back to the Mets. But giving up a pick for a declining middle infielder with poor defense is just a bad move to make. Just because they missed on one guy doesn't mean they should make a move like this just for the sake of making a move.

 

 

Desmond isn't a bad defender.

[harfman77]

That's definitely true.

 

Ian Kennedy is never signed by the White Sox. PetCo, shockingly, was the 10th best hr park last year and Kauffman was around 25th. USCF is almost always in the top five to seven, even when you account for our own offense going south in recent years power-wise.

 

If you do have Enciarte and Eaton (who's unlikely to hit 20 again), you need another consistent 25-35 hr threat in there who is average on defense...say, Justin Upton.

 

Those numbers are skewed by the players that play in the park. San Diego went from 24th (HRF .808) in 2014 to 10th (HRF 1.085) in 2015. The difference is that the Padres added Matt Kemp and Justin Upton it didn't all of a sudden become easier to hit HR's there. Kaufman stadium fell again, mostly because the players on the roster are not big HR hitters.

 

Going back since 2010 the teams that have won the WS and their HR rank in MLB

 

2015 - Royals - 24

2014 - Giants - 17

2013 - Red Sox - 6

2012 - Giants - 30

2011 - Cardinals - 13

2010 - Giants - 11

 

You can get by in modern baseball without having a lot of power, but you need guys that get on base. If you can get three guys that play really good defense, can hit around 12-15 HR's a season, and get on base at a clip around .310-.315, you are going to have a really good OF. The problem with building a team that relies on power is that while there are some times they will go through a power surge and hit a ton of balls out, there are also other times where the team will go through prolonged slumps because no one is able to move people over and get runs on the board.

[harfman77]

Desmond isn't a bad defender.

 

Take a second and google "Ian Desmond defense". He is bad.

 

Regardless of what some unreliable defensive statistics may say, by all eyeball accounts, he is bad.

[MHizzle85]

Take a second and google "Ian Desmond defense". He is bad.

 

Regardless of what some unreliable defensive statistics may say, by all eyeball accounts, he is bad.

He's not a bad defender.

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/on-ian-desm...ense-walk-year/

 

This piece was written very early last season after he turned down $105 mil. His throwing was a bit shaky, but his range makes up for it.

 

So to say he's a "bad" defender is a bit of a stretch. Is he a great defender? Nope. Is he an upgrade from Alexei, defense wise? Probably.

[GreenSox]

Ian Desmond's OPS has gone down for 4 successive years. Last year it was .674. To expect that to suddenly change if he's on the Sox is howling at the moon. No way is that worth a draft choice. It's not a quality investment.

 

The biggest weakness (among several weaknesses) on the Sox right is the abysmal OF defense. That could be mitigated somewhat by using Schuck consistently in late innings, if Ventura is up for it (but he wasn't last year; that may have been due partially, but not totally, because the Sox were behind so often in late innings).

 

Given that the Sox gave up 3 young players for 2 years of Frazier, and weakened OF and BP in the process, they have to do something about the OF to at least give themselves a chance to contend. The idea of signing the averagish Fowler makes me queasy, but it would be better than Desmond.

I'd still go cheap for now and get Jackson and see if he and Shuck can be used to field a defensive void.

Edited January 25, 2016 by GreenSox

[Baron]

He's not a bad defender.

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/on-ian-desm...ense-walk-year/

 

This piece was written very early last season after he turned down $105 mil. His throwing was a bit shaky, but his range makes up for it.

 

So to say he's a "bad" defender is a bit of a stretch. Is he a great defender? Nope. Is he an upgrade from Alexei, defense wise? Probably.

 

 

Plus according to DRS he's actually a pretty noticeable upgrade to Alexei.

[LDF]

Plus according to DRS he's actually a pretty noticeable upgrade to Alexei.

 

but let me ask this question that was discuss either yesterday or the day before.

 

should his splits, for his career, on AL hitting or lack off, should anyone take that into consideration???

[GGajewski18]

Ian Desmond's OPS has gone down for 4 successive years. Last year it was .674. To expect that to suddenly change if he's on the Sox is howling at the moon. No way is that worth a draft choice. It's not a quality investment.

 

The biggest weakness (among several weaknesses) on the Sox right is the abysmal OF defense. That could be mitigated somewhat by using Schuck consistently in late innings, if Ventura is up for it (but he wasn't last year; that may have been due partially, but not totally, because the Sox were behind so often in late innings).

 

Given that the Sox gave up 3 young players for 2 years of Frazier, and weakened OF and BP in the process, they have to do something about the OF to at least give themselves a chance to contend. The idea of signing the averagish Fowler makes me queasy, but it would be better than Desmond.

I'd still go cheap for now and get Jackson and see if he and Shuck can be used to field a defensive void.

 

In the 2nd half last season, his average was 262 and had an OPS over 770.

[OmarComing25]

In the 2nd half last season, his average was 262 and had an OPS over 770.

Yeah for a poster who likes to harp on Frazier's 2nd half stats, Desmond had a higher WAR after the All-Star Break than the likes of Anthony Rizzo, JD Martinez, and Justin Upton, and was equal to Nolan Arenado.

[Vance Law]

It was absolutely a no-brainer to have brought Cespedes in

 

Offering Cespedes a $30 million one year deal was a no-brainer?

[southsider2k5]

Offering Cespedes a $30 million one year deal was a no-brainer?

 

Judging by the $110 million he turned down from Washington, which included its own opt outs, I doubt that would have been enough.

[GreenSox]

Yeah for a poster who likes to harp on Frazier's 2nd half stats, Desmond had a higher WAR after the All-Star Break than the likes of Anthony Rizzo, JD Martinez, and Justin Upton, and was equal to Nolan Arenado.

When you have to use 1/2 season stats to justify major investments, it kind of makes my point. Not to mention Desmond's defense is less than exemplary. I wouldn't have gotten either one of them. And a bad 2nd half wasn't the only reason I didn't want Frazier (bad splits; Sox terrible historical track record with NL sluggers; we had 3B hole filled adequately; Frazier cost 3 good ML ready prospects).

 

Not getting one of the big 3 OF is a big miss. If we take Hahn at his word that he wants to build this org. so it consistently wins, you have to use the FA market, esp. one who wouldn't cost a draft pick. And when KW puts forth this artificial 3 year window, which is now year 2, when OF was as big a problem as 3B (bigger defensively last year), and yet they let these players pass, it speaks loudly of lack of coherent front office strategy.

Edited January 26, 2016 by GreenSox

[BlackSox13]

Jon Morosi of MLB Network, reports that Cardinals current shortstop, Jhonny Perslta, has recently spoke to team officials stating that he is open to playing different positions in the future. How soon in the future or just what that means is uncertain, however with Desmond's name being talked about from people close to the Cardinals camp, this could be a fit.

 

http://showmestatesportsreport.sportsblog....n-desmond-.html

 

 

With [steve] Pearce's signing, which should be made official early this week, the formation of the Rays' roster seems just about set.

 

That is, unless they find a way to make it work financially to sign free agent SS Ian Desmond.

 

His lack of a deal elsewhere increases at least the possibility of the Sarasota native fulfilling his interest in coming home on a short-term "pillow" deal, though a major hurdle is that it would cost the Rays a valued draft pick.

 

http://www.draysbay.com/2016/1/25/10821340...ors-ian-desmond

 

Some pretty interesting things said about Desmond in the Rays' link and there's a few videos as well.