White Sox interested in SS Ian Desmond

[SCCWS]

now if this is all done, the one question i wanted to asked since yesterday is this.

 

let say the sox trade for an OF'er, 1. would all be happy here???

 

my answer is yes..... i can live as i said yesterday with Avi as a platoon with laroche at the dh.

 

at SS, some poster made a comment last week of maybe anderson will be ready at mid season.

 

i can see saladino at SS, for a 1/2 season or more. but if anderson hit and continues to hit in ST, should the sox keep him up????

 

I'll start w the last. It does depend on when he hit. The first half of spring training is filled w abs against ML pitchers often working on something or minor league pitchers getting a ST look. If Anderson hits well against ML pitching later in the spring and fields his position at ML qulity, he show stay up when the team heads north.

In regards to an Of, it depends on the price if it is a trade. The Sox need to beef up their farm and a trade that deletes several of their top prospects better be for a can't miss type OF. Trading a bullpen piece for an OF would be a better alternative if it yields a good return.

 

[LDF]

I'll start w the last. It does depend on when he hit. The first half of spring training is filled w abs against ML pitchers often working on something or minor league pitchers getting a ST look. If Anderson hits well against ML pitching later in the spring and fields his position at ML qulity, he show stay up when the team heads north.

In regards to an Of, it depends on the price if it is a trade. The Sox need to beef up their farm and a trade that deletes several of their top prospects better be for a can't miss type OF. Trading a bullpen piece for an OF would be a better alternative if it yields a good return.

 

excellent post.

 

now with ref to anderson, i am flopping around like a fish out of water. part of me say if he is hitting, keep him up, but the other part is can he defend his position, SS. i guess i would have to depend on the coaches to decide that. but i have faith in his hitting to keep him up.

 

OF, i am going on what was discussed on previous posts, that the sox may look toward the trade route. i just hope, and i really don't see the sox having the assets to get someone meaningful but if the trade is done. well i will be happy, now if its for someone not really note worthy, i have to take that on a day by day basis. plus the cost for me is what it will tell..... i think the Fa route is the safer bet.

[southsider2k5]

you want honesty, i will tell you. no matter what i write or say, you will go off and rant. as you have in the past and when you are caught in the wrong, you will convenient delete the who post to a point that is less embarrassing. it is nice to be a Admin to have that power to cover your butt.

 

so why should i bother to reply to you ?????

 

to get berated and oh, i forgot those so called lies i accuse you to show.... but never did, oh yeah the other admin jump in to stop me from continuing to embarrass you.

 

this was all done, but you needed to egg it on. really petty...... maybe even childish. all this from an ADMIN.

 

So, just for the record, you could have actually posted what payroll number you seem to think the Sox can have, and instead you personally attacked me. Just remember that next time you ask someone else a question.

[SCCWS]

So, just for the record, you could have actually posted what payroll number you seem to think the Sox can have, and instead you personally attacked me. Just remember that next time you ask someone else a question.

 

 

Give the person a break. He tried to change the subject by posting some legit questions but you chose to regurgitate the payroll issue. Time to drop the childish antics.

[LDF]

Give the person a break. He tried to change the subject by posting some legit questions but you chose to regurgitate the payroll issue. Time to drop the childish antics.

 

many thanks and i am dropping it, lets talk baseball. sox baseball.

 

my other question i wanted to ask is this, even if anderson does hit, should the sox rush him???? i keep thinking of Micah Johnson and how they had to send him down.

[southsider2k5]

Give the person a break. He tried to change the subject by posting some legit questions but you chose to regurgitate the payroll issue. Time to drop the childish antics.

 

The source post included this quote.

 

instead of the token amount they spend 120 mil

 

When you you a phrase like that, it infers that they have a lot more money free to spend. I would like to know how much that amount is, and how they know it. With a statement like that, it is a fair question. I didn't bring it up, he did. But I am curious to what extent he knows the finances of the White Sox to call $120 million, a "token amount".

[LDF]

The source post included this quote.

 

 

 

When you you a phrase like that, it infers that they have a lot more money free to spend. I would like to know how much that amount is, and how they know it. With a statement like that, it is a fair question. I didn't bring it up, he did. But I am curious to what extent he knows the finances of the White Sox to call $120 million, a "token amount".

 

this is really not worth anymore aggravation esp coming from those others who feels that they need to defend you.

 

i am over this.

[iamshack]

The source post included this quote.

 

 

 

When you you a phrase like that, it infers that they have a lot more money free to spend. I would like to know how much that amount is, and how they know it. With a statement like that, it is a fair question. I didn't bring it up, he did. But I am curious to what extent he knows the finances of the White Sox to call $120 million, a "token amount".

Are you really curious, or are you more interested in trying to embarrass the poster?

[southsider2k5]

Are you really curious, or are you more interested in trying to embarrass the poster?

 

Nothing I have seen through the public numbers suggests that $120 million is "a token" of what the White Sox have to spend. If there is something else out there, I'd like to know it.

[Baron]

[caulfield12]

Have the White Sox ever "doubled down" and increased spending significantly over two consecutive offseasons when they were coming off a below .500 or 4th/5th place finish before that second increase?

 

Where they were increasing spending into the teeth of an expected flat revenue year?

 

Obviously, there's not much conclusive to go on...the LaRoche salary dump rumors, the willingness or not to surrender a pick for a second tier performer, the won't go past three years for fa's and lots of rumors/smoke.

 

Typically in this situation we'd expect to be guided to a "will reassess and adjust at the deadline" way of thinking...but we're in that .500ish no man's land between 18th-22nd in the majors and 3rd/4th in the division that both the fans and front office are forced to sit back and wait on the other. The fans don't feel the front office has done quite enough to be a true contender, and the front office is frustrated with fan support and doesn't want to lose too much money.

 

Realistically, $130-135 million was the range the majority of more "optimistic" fans expected.

Edited February 15, 2016 by caulfield12

[Quin]

$120 million is a lot of f***ing money.

[caulfield12]

$120 million is a lot of f***ing money.

 

Yes, Quinarv, compared to a decade ago.

 

As it stands right now, though, that $120 million mark is basically the mode for MLB payrolls, with 50% of the teams above and 50% below.

 

We're also third in the division, right in the middle again. Fortunately, we don't have to worry about the Indians and Twins outspending us, but they both have the luxury (besides Mauer) of being relatively younger and cheaper teams for the next couple of seasons.

 

So obviously you can compete at $120, but you consequently have a razor thin margin of error and have to repeat the nearly perfect health trick again.

Edited February 15, 2016 by caulfield12

[LDF]

Yes, Quinarv, compared to a decade ago.

 

As it stands right now, though, that $120 million mark is basically the mode for MLB payrolls, with 50% of the teams above and 50% below.

 

We're also third in the division, right in the middle again. Fortunately, we don't have to worry about the Indians and Twins outspending us, but they both have the luxury (besides Mauer) of being relatively younger and cheaper teams for the next couple of seasons.

 

So obviously you can compete at $120, but you consequently have a razor thin margin of error and have to repeat the nearly perfect health trick again.

 

lets not forget that the sox will have 1 or 2 missing pieces to really make this team stronger, maybe even getting a legitimate chase for a playoff spot. yet the owners have stated of wanting another WS ring...... well they can not have the WS ring, unless they have to go all in. but this is this yrs, what about all the other yrs?

 

btw, it is thru their fault that the state of the system is in this condition, they are at the helm.

 

120 million is a token amount. enuf to appear that the team is trying to win and not enuf to get into their profit margin. problem is, many fans are getting smarter and hopefully not buy into all the fluff. best way to get their attention, do not buy game tickets.

[Chicago White Sox]

$120 million is a lot of f***ing money.

It's a pretty average amount and one that we surpassed as far back as the 2008 & 2011 seasons.

[Dick Allen]

$120 million is a lot of f***ing money.

Neither WS team had a $120 million payroll last season. In fact, both started last season below the White Sox. The Sox have had some much better than average team payrolls the last 5 or 6 years. And while I agree, the model to go into a season short hoping to add, is one this franchise has played out, cheap is not been what this team has been, especially if you consider thing like attendance.

 

 

http://www.stevetheump.com/Payrolls.htm

 

 

What wins games is talent, not how much you are paying him. If Sale were paid market rate, and Quintana for that matter, payroll wouldn't even be discussed.

Edited February 15, 2016 by Dick Allen

[hogan873]

lets not forget that the sox will have 1 or 2 missing pieces to really make this team stronger, maybe even getting a legitimate chase for a playoff spot. yet the owners have stated of wanting another WS ring...... well they can not have the WS ring, unless they have to go all in. but this is this yrs, what about all the other yrs?

 

btw, it is thru their fault that the state of the system is in this condition, they are at the helm.

 

120 million is a token amount. enuf to appear that the team is trying to win and not enuf to get into their profit margin. problem is, many fans are getting smarter and hopefully not buy into all the fluff. best way to get their attention, do not buy game tickets.

I can see your point, but you have to look deeper and see what the $120 million is being spent on. There's $29 million of that money being spent on a guy that hit .207 last season and a pitcher who is not the guy he used to be. And one could also argue that there's another $14 million being spent on a left fielder that is under-performing. There are teams out there who have a lower payroll than the Sox, but they're better because they have the money spent on the right players. Increasing the payroll to show the fans that they're serious isn't the answer. Spending the money on the right guys is the answer. And I bet that is part of why we're seeing the Sox take their time. Look at the Latos deal. Back when Fister was signed, speculation was that Latos would get at least what Fister got. But the Sox were patient and got him for the kind of money that at worst is a win/whatever situation.

 

The fans are not buying tickets because the payroll is "only" $120 million. They're not buying tickets because the product on the field has been lackluster.

[caulfield12]

It's important to note both those teams had the payroll flexibility to not only add signifiant pieces at the trade deadline, they also had the more important ability to buy premium talent with surplus prospect depth (Cespedes, Cueto, Zobrist).

 

Both teams ended up much higher in payroll than where they began the season.

Edited February 15, 2016 by caulfield12

[Thad Bosley]

It's a pretty average amount and one that we surpassed as far back as the 2008 & 2011 seasons.

An average amount with 35% of it all wrapped up in Danks, Cabrera, and LaRoche. Yikes.

 

To channel my inner-Hawk: don't tell me how much you spend. Tell me who you spend it on!

[lasttriptotulsa]

I can see your point, but you have to look deeper and see what the $120 million is being spent on. There's $29 million of that money being spent on a guy that hit .207 last season and a pitcher who is not the guy he used to be. And one could also argue that there's another $14 million being spent on a left fielder that is under-performing. There are teams out there who have a lower payroll than the Sox, but they're better because they have the money spent on the right players. Increasing the payroll to show the fans that they're serious isn't the answer. Spending the money on the right guys is the answer. And I bet that is part of why we're seeing the Sox take their time. Look at the Latos deal. Back when Fister was signed, speculation was that Latos would get at least what Fister got. But the Sox were patient and got him for the kind of money that at worst is a win/whatever situation.

 

The fans are not buying tickets because the payroll is "only" $120 million. They're not buying tickets because the product on the field has been lackluster.

 

They are also just spending a combined $18 million on the front four of their rotation who all have either #1 or #2 starter potential and just $2.75 million on their starting center fielder and lead off hitter whose been a 3.3 average fWAR player over his Sox career. They may have a couple bad contracts on the books but they have way more plus value contracts than they do bad ones. The Sox have made a lot of really good deals over the past few years so I'll let a couple bad contracts slide. If they hadn't have been proactive and signed Sale to an extension early on like they did this would be his last year in a Sox uniform and he would be making double the money he's making this year.

[Thad Bosley]

Neither WS team had a $120 million payroll last season. In fact, both started last season below the White Sox. The Sox have had some much better than average team payrolls the last 5 or 6 years. And while I agree, the model to go into a season short hoping to add, is one this franchise has played out, cheap is not been what this team has been, especially if you consider thing like attendance.

 

 

http://www.stevetheump.com/Payrolls.htm

 

 

What wins games is talent, not how much you are paying him. If Sale were paid market rate, and Quintana for that matter, payroll wouldn't even be discussed.

Oh yes it would be. If the team was managing to an unimpressive payroll in this day and age of $123M, AND they were actually paying their core a market rate, just imagine the junk they'd be surrounding those guys with. Third tier players all around!

[Dick Allen]

It's important to note both those teams had the payroll flexibility to not only add signifiant pieces at the trade deadline, they also had the more important ability to buy premium talent with surplus prospect depth (Cespedes, Cueto, Zobrist).

 

Both teams ended up much higher in payroll than where they began the season.

How come in your Royals manifesto you said the Royals didn't pick up salary with Zobrist and Cueto? If they didn't pick it up, how is their payroll increased? Not picking up money doesn't equal payroll flexibility.

 

Also, the White Sox did make a run at Cespedes at the deadline.

Edited February 15, 2016 by Dick Allen

[caulfield12]

How come in your Royals manifesto you said the Royals didn't pick up salary with Zobrist and Cueto? If they didn't pick it up, how is their payroll increased? Not picking up money doesn't equal payroll flexibility.

 

Also, the White Sox did make a run at Cespedes at the deadline.

 

The Mets...

[caulfield12]

They are also just spending a combined $18 million on the front four of their rotation who all have either #1 or #2 starter potential and just $2.75 million on their starting center fielder and lead off hitter whose been a 3.3 average fWAR player over his Sox career. They may have a couple bad contracts on the books but they have way more plus value contracts than they do bad ones. The Sox have made a lot of really good deals over the past few years so I'll let a couple bad contracts slide. If they hadn't have been proactive and signed Sale to an extension early on like they did this would be his last year in a Sox uniform and he would be making double the money he's making this year.

 

I think you have it slightly backwards...they have good or great deals with Sale, Quintana, Eaton, Rodon and Abreu and meh everywhere else.

 

Frazier should probably be added to that aforementioned overperforming list if he's closer to replicating his first rather than second half last year.

 

Finally, Latos, Avila and Lawrie all could end up as bargains as well.

[Dick Allen]

The Mets...

Mets paid Cespedes about $4 million. Maybe a little less. If this payroll "flexibility" is so important, you should be applauding the White Sox, a team you have already told us several times is broke, for not spending every last dime now.