lasttriptotulsa Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 08:42 AM) The point is to avoid situations like the Danks contract that hamstring payroll flexibility. But I'm sure you will still argue we got our money's worth, nevertheless. Danks signed a very reasonable contract for the type of pitcher that he was at the time. If you're not willing to give out a relatively close to market deal to extend your number 1 starter you're never going to be able to compete. It's not the fault of the Sox or Danks that he his career got derailed by injury. He also had so much excess value before he signed that contract that overall he has earned every penny that the Sox have paid him. Edited January 28, 2016 by lasttriptotulsa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) Signing Q and Sale to their extensions probably saved the White Sox, assuming they were to keep them, close to $100 million. Just dumb, right Caulfield? They would have been much smarter moving the fences back, getting 3 elite defensive OF, and signing Ian Kennedy for $70 million. Edited January 28, 2016 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Oh wait I always forget about his first year in the pen. That's what always throws it off for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipps Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 09:02 AM) Sale is a LOCK to leave when his contract is over. The Sox will never pay him what he'll be worth. I'm just enjoying him now, because I know he'll be gone in a few years. If FO believes that he is a lock to leave they need to trade in 2 years to maximize that return then. So he may be gone in two years actually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipps Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 How many more years is Sale signed through again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 QUOTE (shipps @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 09:20 AM) How many more years is Sale signed through again? Signed thru 2017 with 2018 and 2019 team options that will be exercised. 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (shipps @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 09:19 AM) If FO believes that he is a lock to leave they need to trade in 2 years to maximize that return then. So he may be gone in two years actually. If the next 2 years are bad and the future looks bleak, I could see them opening up to the possibility mid-2017. Also depends on the arms coming up which could still be drafted this year/already in the system. Edited January 28, 2016 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 28, 2016 Author Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 09:06 AM) Yes it did. And nothing that guy says ever makes much sense. Ummmm....Buster Olney said it, so he doesn't make sense. Once again, he's attributing someone else's words, but I doubt he even took the time to read what Olney wrote in the first place without jumping to conclusions. Go back to the original article and read the third paragraph. I never once brought up Sale and Quintana, and neither did Olney. The Sox mistake with John Danks is a lot closer to the situation he wrote that paragraph about...in terms of risk-aversion with pitchers at that point in their careers. But then that would make a strong argument against Olney. Read post #9 and explain how that has anything to do with what Olney said....it's strawman stuff. Edited January 28, 2016 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 10:12 AM) Ummmm....Buster Olney said it, so he doesn't make sense. Once again, he's attributing someone else's words, but I doubt he even took the time to read what Olney wrote in the first place without jumping to conclusions. Go back to the original article and read the third paragraph. I never once brought up Sale and Quintana, and neither did Olney. The Sox mistake with John Danks is a lot closer to the situation he wrote that paragraph about...in terms of risk-aversion with pitchers at that point in their careers. Make sense now? Read post #9 and explain how that has anything to do with what Olney said....it's strawman stuff. No the John Danks mention makes no sense because guess who was 1 year away from free agency when he signed an extension? Don't sign pitchers to extensions until one year before the become free agents or else you will have a John Danks situation. You know, the guy that signed an extension one year before he became a free agent. Caulfied ripping the White Sox with made up facts, take 10,156. Edited January 28, 2016 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 28, 2016 Author Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 10:23 AM) No the John Danks mention makes no sense because guess who was 1 year away from free agency when he signed an extension? Don't sign pitchers to extensions until one year before the become free agents or else you will have a John Danks situation. You know, the guy that signed an extension one year before he became a free agent. Caulfied ripping the White Sox with made up facts, take 10,156. And your point that Quintana and Sale are great bargains and will never get injured, therefore disproving Olney...right? How can you possibly argue that until they both successfully reach the end of their 5th season as starters? I suppose you're also a fortune teller? You can't even answer a simple question about how much you would limit your offer to Dexter Fowler to after spending the last 2-3 weeks hyping his addition every single day. Now why is that? Edited January 28, 2016 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 10:33 AM) And your point that Quintana and Sale are great bargains and will never get injured, therefore disproving Olney...right? How can you possibly argue that until they both successfully reach the end of their 5th seasons? I suppose you're also a fortune teller? The have already saved money with Sale. You can argue he is no bargain, and everyone will laugh at you, but again, if you look at the facts, Sale and Q can be bought out the final 2 years for $1 million. So once again, you are way off. Don't let facts stop you Caulfield, those were clearly misguided extensions. They should be like the Royals and spend $70 million on Ian Kennedy. Edited January 28, 2016 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 28, 2016 Author Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 10:36 AM) The have already saved money with Sale. You can argue he is no bargain, and everyone will laugh at you, but again, if you look at the facts, Sale and Q can be bought out the final 2 years for $1 million. So once again, you are way off. If you're going to value war at $7-8 million, then Desmond and Jackson are no brainers, too. The problem is the White Sox won't get that same deal from Boras on Rodon, and everyone in baseball thinks it would be dangerous to offer it to Fulmer. And despite those bargains with Sale and Quintana, they still haven't created enough payroll flexibility to have a truly competitive team because of Danks and LaRoche. Edited January 28, 2016 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 28, 2016 Author Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 10:36 AM) The have already saved money with Sale. You can argue he is no bargain, and everyone will laugh at you, but again, if you look at the facts, Sale and Q can be bought out the final 2 years for $1 million. So once again, you are way off. Don't let facts stop you Caulfield, those were clearly misguided extensions. They should be like the Royals and spend $70 million on Ian Kennedy. Why don't you spend your time and write to Buster Olney instead...tell him that Sale and Quintana rebut his theory, just like John Danks does as well. See if he reconsiders his position. Edited January 28, 2016 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 10:42 AM) If you're going to value war at $7-8 million, the Desmond and Jackson are no brainers, too. The problem is the White Sox won't get that same deal from Boras on Rodon, and everyone in baseball thinks it would be dangerous to offer it to Fulmer. Now you are arguing in favor of the deals you said are bad. Are you trying not to make sense? So far, long term extensions to pitchers are bad. But Sale, Quintana? Still bad, do you really think Buster Olney would have it wrong. You wait until 1 year before they become free agents to offer extensions, because...John Danks. John Danks was extended one year before he became a free agent. But Sale and Quintana, what if they get hurt. Yes, but the Sox have safeguards in the contracts in case of those events. Still dumb, and Boras will never give you that for Rodon. So according to you, he is doing the White Sox a favor. It would be stupid locking him up to a contract that bought out free agent years because....John Danks. No sense at all and now flipping to the other side. It is hysterical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 28, 2016 Author Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 10:48 AM) Now you are arguing in favor of the deals you said are bad. Are you trying not to make sense? So far, long term extensions to pitchers are bad. But Sale, Quintana? Still bad, do you really think Buster Olney would have it wrong. You wait until 1 year before they become free agents to offer extensions, because...John Danks. John Danks was extended one year before he became a free agent. But Sale and Quintana, what if they get hurt. Yes, but the Sox have safeguards in the contracts in case of those events. Still dumb, and Boras will never give you that for Rodon. So according to you, he is doing the White Sox a favor. It would be stupid locking him up to a contract that bought out free agent years because....John Danks. No sense at all and now flipping to the other side. It is hysterical. Wow, then they should be able to use all those safeguards to easily entice a good hitter once every ten years, lol. Whatever...but I'm sure your confidence (that has nothing to do with Don Cooper since he sucks according to you) in keeping our pitching staff healthy year after year will be borne out. Edited January 28, 2016 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lasttriptotulsa Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 10:42 AM) If you're going to value war at $7-8 million, then Desmond and Jackson are no brainers, too. The problem is the White Sox won't get that same deal from Boras on Rodon, and everyone in baseball thinks it would be dangerous to offer it to Fulmer. And despite those bargains with Sale and Quintana, they still haven't created enough payroll flexibility to have a truly competitive team because of Danks and LaRoche. I think it's pretty clear that Danks and LaRoche's contracts are not holding anything back. Just look at all the people they attempted to sign in the past couple years Tanaka - who cost $100 million plus Samardzija - they were willing to give an extension until the relationship soured Gordon - he had no intention of leaving unless somebody blew the Royals offer away Upton - he had no interest in the Sox Cespedes - Wanted to remain a Met, is getting $27.5 million for a one year deal basically, is not worth that money in any way, shape or form Fowler - Reported interest, level remains to be seen Desmond - Reported interest, level remains to be seen It's quite clear that the money is there to spend for the right player. Are they going to spend the kind of money it would take to sign a Scherzer, Heyward or Greinke? No and I'm glad because those huge $30 million deals almost always bite the team in the ass. You think the Angels would sign Hamilton or Pujols again given the chance? Hell no. The Tigers will be regretting the Cabrera deal in another couple years. If the White Sox biggest problem is owing LaRoche $13 million or Danks $15 million, I think they are making pretty smart business deals. Edited January 28, 2016 by lasttriptotulsa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 10:51 AM) Wow, then they should be able to use all those safeguards to easily entice a good hitter once every ten years, lol. Whatever...but I'm sure your confidence (that has nothing to do with Don Cooper since he sucks according to you) in keeping our pitching staff healthy year after year will be borne out. There it is. No reply so the Don Cooper card. Find one post where I said he sucks. What's next, Gordon Beckham? Your posts just make me laugh. You refuse to fact check anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Possibly baseball will go bankrupt!? Or he other alternative is the teams have one grossly overpaid contract and 24 A ball player contracts. These figures are outrageous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 11:41 AM) Possibly baseball will go bankrupt!? Or he other alternative is the teams have one grossly overpaid contract and 24 A ball player contracts. These figures are outrageous Not even close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 QUOTE (EvilJester99 @ Jan 28, 2016 -> 08:49 AM) Sox will go no more than 3.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 Jeff Passan @JeffPassan 27m27 minutes ago The Yankees have spent $0 this winter. Why? They might need $500M for Bryce Harper in 2018. Column on NY austerity: http://yhoo.it/1L1318C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 FOX Sports: MLB @MLBONFOX 13m13 minutes ago Bryce Harper on potential $400 million deal: 'Don't sell me short' -->http://foxs.pt/1R040dO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 It will certainly be interesting but not many players arrive at age 19 as super stars and allow you to get 5-6 years of their prime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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