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Avi's new swing, video


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QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Feb 24, 2016 -> 04:00 PM)
3rd highest walk rate and 4th highest OBP on the team last year. If he could hit for the .175 - .200 ISO like a guy with his size and power should be he would be fine on offense.

 

lol that just says how bad we were as a team last year...

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QUOTE (raBBit @ Feb 24, 2016 -> 04:26 PM)
WTF. That can't be right. Wow.

 

Of players who would actually qualify for a batting title, Avi was third in BB% at 6% last year behind LaRoche and Adam Eaton. He was fourth in OBP behind Abreu, Eaton, and Melky.

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QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Feb 24, 2016 -> 05:00 PM)
3rd highest walk rate and 4th highest OBP on the team last year. If he could hit for the .175 - .200 ISO like a guy with his size and power should be he would be fine on offense.

 

It's not about walks -- he swings and makes contact with terrible pitches. His O-Swing% (46.6%) was worst on the team by more than eight percentage points, and third worst in the entire MLB (league average was 31.3%). This causes him to make bad contact, which is a significant contributor to his curiously low power numbers.

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QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 08:58 AM)
It's not about walks -- he swings and makes contact with terrible pitches. His O-Swing% (46.6%) was worst on the team by more than eight percentage points, and third worst in the entire MLB (league average was 31.3%). This causes him to make bad contact, which is a significant contributor to his curiously low power numbers.

 

My point was that you could live with Avi's .257 AVG and .309 OBP if he were hitting for power. If his SLG was in the .450's his offense would not be the biggest problem. Of all the things that you can complain about Avi, his OBP and walk rate are not at the top of the list.

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QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 10:03 AM)
My point was that you could live with Avi's .257 AVG and .309 OBP if he were hitting for power. If his SLG was in the .450's his offense would not be the biggest problem. Of all the things that you can complain about Avi, his OBP and walk rate are not at the top of the list.

 

That's true, but the factors that lead to his AVG/OBP/BB% are many of the same that make his SLG so bad. His approach/pitch recognition are to blame for nearly all of his issues at the plate.

 

If you take the approach of extreme optimism, it's possible that a new stance/swing could give him a better look at the ball and allow him to react to the pitch quicker, but I think it's more likely that the problem is his eyes. Ironically, the fact that he was willing to try to take a few walks last year only strengthens my belief that he can't hit, because that removes "willingness to be patient" from the list of possible solutions.

 

I know you're probably just frustrated with the negativity, and I've been a source of way more of it than usual across the entire forum. FWIW, I still really hope I'm wrong about Avi.

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QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 09:03 AM)
My point was that you could live with Avi's .257 AVG and .309 OBP if he were hitting for power. If his SLG was in the .450's his offense would not be the biggest problem. Of all the things that you can complain about Avi, his OBP and walk rate are not at the top of the list.

Yes, if Avi's slugging was 85 points higher we'd all be a lot happier with him. That doesn't make a .309 OBP good, it just means he has numerous other flaws. If he only had one flaw, the OBP, I'd be a big fan.

 

What I think you're trying to say is that based on his build, hitting for more power is an easier path to improvement for Avi than taking more walks. This makes a little more sense because we know the power is in there, he just can't apply it. In contrast, the patience might just be a lost art to him.

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QUOTE (shysocks @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 09:22 AM)
Yes, if Avi's slugging was 85 points higher we'd all be a lot happier with him. That doesn't make a .309 OBP good, it just means he has numerous other flaws. If he only had one flaw, the OBP, I'd be a big fan.

 

What I think you're trying to say is that based on his build, hitting for more power is an easier path to improvement for Avi than taking more walks. This makes a little more sense because we know the power is in there, he just can't apply it. In contrast, the patience might just be a lost art to him.

At least they are trying something different. A different stance made all the difference in the world to Nelson Cruz, a guy who had similar issues . The odds are against it, but you never know. The Sox are due for some things like this to go their way.

Edited by Dick Allen
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QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 25, 2016 -> 09:28 AM)
At least they are trying something different. A different stance made all the difference in the world to Nelson Cruz, a guy who had similar issues . The odds are against it, but you never know. The Sox are due for some things like this to go their way.

 

The other good sign is that he is willing to try, which means he is some level of coachable.

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Watching Avi in the cage made me wonder something you might be able to answer for me. I would have started a new thread but it's kind of random/silly and people would probably jump me.

 

I was wondering ... during the season and spring training, especially baseball teams need men to throw BP, extra BP, so many BP pitches to hitters. How do teams get this accomplished? You'd think if coaches throw BP every single day to 40 players or more, their arms would fall off.

Seriously ... who throws all this BP during spring traning and the regular season. I can't imagine 50 year old coaches' arms being able to throw 50 to 70 mph fastballs to hitters all day/every day without their arms falling off.

Do teams employ 50 college kids to throw BP or ???

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QUOTE (greg775 @ Feb 26, 2016 -> 01:16 PM)
Watching Avi in the cage made me wonder something you might be able to answer for me. I would have started a new thread but it's kind of random/silly and people would probably jump me.

 

I was wondering ... during the season and spring training, especially baseball teams need men to throw BP, extra BP, so many BP pitches to hitters. How do teams get this accomplished? You'd think if coaches throw BP every single day to 40 players or more, their arms would fall off.

Seriously ... who throws all this BP during spring traning and the regular season. I can't imagine 50 year old coaches' arms being able to throw 50 to 70 mph fastballs to hitters all day/every day without their arms falling off.

Do teams employ 50 college kids to throw BP or ???

 

 

70MPH is pushing it for BP... 50 is much more like it.

 

I have coached many collegiate hitters and have thrown hours and hours and hours of BP... first few rounds of our winter workouts when I'd throw BP I'd feel it the next day, but that's because I'm old and fat. After a few days your arm gets used to it and you just experience general soreness. Once I would get my arm lose, I'd be fine. Never felt pain at all. That said, it might be a little different than throwing BP every day for 8 months or so.

 

 

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I'm surprised that probably 80% of this board wants to throw Avi out with the bath water now, when he's only in his age 24-25 season. Guys like Carlos Gomez or Aaron Rowand come to mind as guys who didn't develop until age 26 or 27. I realize we have a limited time to contend here and we should be trying to win now, but still, maybe management is gambling he can have a rebound season and put up some decent numbers. There's no guarantee any of the FA or trade options left are going to produce more than Avi this year, I suspect.

Edited by JohnCangelosi
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QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ Feb 27, 2016 -> 08:23 AM)
I'm surprised that probably 80% of this board wants to throw Avi out with the bath water now, when he's only in his age 24-25 season. Guys like Carlos Gomez or Aaron Rowand come to mind as guys who didn't develop until age 26 or 27. I realize we have a limited time to contend here and we should be trying to win now, but still, maybe management is gambling he can have a rebound season and put up some decent numbers. There's no guarantee any of the FA or trade options left are going to produce more than Avi this year, I suspect.

I agree he can improve, but he needs to improve immensely as a offensive player, or pretty significantly offensively defensively, running the bases, to be a useful player. It can happen, but so far, experience doesn't seem to be an answer. If anything he appears to be going backwards or maintaining in most areas the more he plays. Maybe this new stance shakes things up. Maybe he figures out how to run down fly balls, and judge line drives, maybe he doesn't run into as many easy outs in the bases. But if you truly are going for it, there are too many maybes there. If they bring someone else in and Avi develops like we hope, they will find a spot for him. Guys who can play always play.

 

It is pretty crazy to think the White Sox could possibly be good enough not to have room for a productive player. It is just that Avi needs to show that is what he is,

Edited by Dick Allen
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