southsider2k5 Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 10:12 AM) Rational = evaluating actual results and facts, such as the Sox' record of performance. Irrational = casting baseless aspersions about an entire fan base. Irrational = making references to an organization's level of resources when you have no facts to support such references. Irrational in the sense that you seem to think that one thing is all that matters. The rest of it is just reinforcing your already decided opinion, even though they can just as easily be said about you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 10:22 AM) that is one thing that many can not see, what is or what will this site be if we are all followers. no one to have a different opinion that the mods / admin has?? this is not a negative rant against the admin / mods, but many are afraid to cross them and their opinions. a healthy discussion is great, with a difference of opinions. esp if no cussing is used to express their opinions. it makes for great reading. This is just ridiculous. You play this card all of the time, but the fact that you are still here, and not banned or even suspended for should tell you everything you need to know. There is no conspiracy against you or anyone else. If there was, you wouldn't still be posting here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 05:17 PM) This is just ridiculous. You play this card all of the time, but the fact that you are still here, and not banned or even suspended for should tell you everything you need to know. There is no conspiracy against you or anyone else. If there was, you wouldn't still be posting here. what are you talking about !!! my comment was not meant to offend no one or as a rant against any one. i just pointed out that a difference of opinions is what make this sire thrives. just b/c some poster do not put you on a pedestal, but has the guts to challenge your pov. get real and smell what you are shoveling. and i am sure you really wanted to on several occasion, Davers > wsi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 05:15 PM) Irrational in the sense that you seem to think that one thing is all that matters. The rest of it is just reinforcing your already decided opinion, even though they can just as easily be said about you. then argue his pov. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 (edited) btw, what ever happened to the short lived proclamation of, if the admin or mods has a problem, they will PM that poster...... only rules to suit themselves. Edited February 28, 2016 by LDF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 LMFAO. I love a good train wreck! /thread... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad Bosley Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 12:15 PM) Irrational in the sense that you seem to think that one thing is all that matters. So the desire of a fan for his/her team to win is somehow "irrational"? Gotcha. Thanks for shedding some light on your position on the matter. Says it all right there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 12:14 PM) LMFAO. I love a good train wreck! /thread... NASCAR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 01:13 PM) So the desire of a fan for his/her team to win is somehow "irrational"? Gotcha. Thanks for shedding some light on your position on the matter. Says it all right there! No but the constant bashing of the ownership and not the players is. You blast them for spending money on free agents (LaRoche/Cabrera) but want them to spend twice that amount on another one. Instead of blaming the onwership for spending money and not spending money at the same time you should throw a little blame at the players for not performing like they are capable of doing. I would guess most fans are frustrated with the team and their performance. However, I would also say I thought the team on paper looked pretty good last year with all of the additions. It was the players who did not perform to their capabilities last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 07:58 PM) No but the constant bashing of the ownership and not the players is. You blast them for spending money on free agents (LaRoche/Cabrera) but want them to spend twice that amount on another one. Instead of blaming the onwership for spending money and not spending money at the same time you should throw a little blame at the players for not performing like they are capable of doing. I would guess most fans are frustrated with the team and their performance. However, I would also say I thought the team on paper looked pretty good last year with all of the additions. It was the players who did not perform to their capabilities last year. yeah, as i said in another post or thread, i went thru 10 pages +/- to see who didn't like the signing of laroche. only 2 posters and those 2 were almost like prophetic in their reasoning's .. you do make a great point on last yr performance. but until then, the state of the system is where the point is, well my points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 02:13 PM) yeah, as i said in another post or thread, i went thru 10 pages +/- to see who didn't like the signing of laroche. only 2 posters and those 2 were almost like prophetic in their reasoning's .. you do make a great point on last yr performance. but until then, the state of the system is where the point is, well my points. Yes but spending money on free agents and losing draft picks is one of the primary causes of the poor farm system. If you truly want a good farm system then you don't want them to sign free agents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 09:18 PM) Yes but spending money on free agents and losing draft picks is one of the primary causes of the poor farm system. If you truly want a good farm system then you don't want them to sign free agents. good point and i agree but you can look at this org state logically and can put a finger on whose fault it really is. now with that said, i am really hesitant on signing a fa's that has a draft pick attached. there are 2 points gong on, 1. should the sox have made every effort to sign fowlers . 2. will the sox add to the roster??? now with that, i would be hard press to sign fowlers, but i can see the necessity of doing so, for the offense that is remaining on the market to be had. second, i keep looking at players for 1 yr rentals, that can be had and signed for far less than anyone imagine. for the last main point, this is where i hope i am wrong. i hope the sox do sign an of'er who can play cf. Edited February 28, 2016 by LDF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 02:18 PM) Yes but spending money on free agents and losing draft picks is one of the primary causes of the poor farm system. If you truly want a good farm system then you don't want them to sign free agents. Except it's a little bit late for that philosophy change after addressing quite a few of the issues on the major league roster...and also not having the position player depth (other than Anderson) to realistically fill those remaining holes over the next two seasons. At that time, we'll have to fill even more holes without buying free agents at the highest prices and/or running into budget limitations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 02:33 PM) Except it's a little bit late for that philosophy change after addressing quite a few of the issues on the major league roster...and also not having the position player depth (other than Anderson) to realistically fill those remaining holes over the next two seasons. At that time, we'll have to fill even more holes without buying free agents at the highest prices and/or running into budget limitations. Funny how you were against giving up,draft picks and anything more than 3 year contracts earlier this offseason. Of course that is when everyone assumed Gordon to the White Sox was likely. Wanted to wait until June to sign Desmond. Wanted to give Latos $10-12 million, wanted to give Parra $8 million, even though he hasn't shown he can hit in the AL, and wanted no part of Fowler and the draft pick, pointing out without realizing he has spent a season in the AL, that he would be a good candidate not to be able to adjust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 01:53 PM) NASCAR Now, how did I know you would say that? SoxTalk short track racing at its finest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 02:33 PM) Except it's a little bit late for that philosophy change after addressing quite a few of the issues on the major league roster...and also not having the position player depth (other than Anderson) to realistically fill those remaining holes over the next two seasons. At that time, we'll have to fill even more holes without buying free agents at the highest prices and/or running into budget limitations. It's not the Sox philosophy it was his comment about not having a good farm system. Personally, the ranking of the farm system is meaningless. A team needs to use the farm system to help the MLB club by either bringing up prospects or trading the prospects for MLB players. The rankings are based on overall talent and depth. I like what the sox dis this year. They traded mediocre players from a system that everyone here says is bad and picked up an all star. As long as they keep the possible impact players and obtain good players they will continually improve the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 10:39 PM) It's not the Sox philosophy it was his comment about not having a good farm system. Personally, the ranking of the farm system is meaningless. A team needs to use the farm system to help the MLB club by either bringing up prospects or trading the prospects for MLB players. The rankings are based on overall talent and depth. I like what the sox dis this year. They traded mediocre players from a system that everyone here says is bad and picked up an all star. As long as they keep the possible impact players and obtain good players they will continually improve the team. you make an excellent point. i too care less about the system ranking among other org, what i care about is having viable prospects who can help the parent team, the white sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabiness42 Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 Here's a list of #27 overall picks. I don't have the last 2, but I think I would trade every single one of them for Dexter Fowler. Porcello could be an exception. The White Sox are really going to have to buck a trend to get impact here, although I do admit, there will be some available: 27th Overall MLB Draft Picks Year Player Pos. Drafted From Drafted By 2013 Phil Ervin OF Samford Cincinnati Reds 2012 Clint Coulter C Union HS (WA) Milwaukee Brewers 2011 Robert Stephenson RHP Alhambra HS (CA) Cincinnati Reds 2010 Jesse Biddle LHP Germantown Frieds HS (PA) Philadelphia Phillies 2009 Michael Franklin SS Lake Brantley HS (Fla.) Seattle Mariners 2008 Carlos Gutierrez RHP University of Miami (Fla.) Minnesota Twins 2007 Rick Porcello RHP Seton Hall (N.J.)Prep Detroit Tigers 2006 Jason Place OF Wren HS Boston Red Sox 2005 Joseph Devine RHP North Carolina St. Atlanta Braves 2004 Taylor Tankersley LHP U Alabama (AL) Florida Marlins 2003 Eric Duncan 3B Seton Hall Prep School (NJ) New York Yankees 2002 Sergio Santos SS Mater Dei HS (CA) Arizona Diamondbacks 2001 Alan Horne P Marianna HS (FL) Cleveland Indians 2000 Robert Stiehl P El Camino College Houston Astros 1999 David Walling P University of Arkansas New York Yankees 1998 Chip Ambres OF West Brook HS (TX) Florida Marlins 1997 Kevin Nicholson SS Stetson University San Diego Padres 1996 A.J. Zapp 1B Center Grove HS (IN) Atlanta Braves 1995 Shea Morenz OF University of Texas New York Yankees 1994 Jacob Shumate P Hartsville HS (SC) Atlanta Braves 1993 Marc Valdes P University of Florida Florida Marlins 1992 John Burke P University of Florida Colorado Rockies 1991 Scott Stahoviak 3B-1B Creighton University Minnesota Twins 1990 Mike Zimmerman P University of South Alabama Pittsburgh Pirates 1989 Todd Jones P Jacksonville State University Houston Astros 1988 Jeff Mutis P Lafayette University Cleveland Indians 1987 Pete Harnisch P Fordham University Baltimore Orioles 1986 Mike Fetters P Pepperdine University California Angels 1985 Bill McGuire C University of Nebraska Seattle Mariners 1984 Gary Green SS Oklahoma State University San Diego Padres 1983 Calvin Schiraldi P University of Texas New York Mets 1982 Stan Boderick OF Robinson HS (Tampa,FL) Chicago Cubs 1981 Kevin Dukes P Arizona State University Seattle Mariners 1980 Jay Tibbs P Huffman HS (AL) New York Mets These are the exactly the kind of "prospects" KW has made a history of trading away for productive players, so no, I'm not interested in giving up this pick for one year of Fowler or Desmond. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 05:20 PM) These are the exactly the kind of "prospects" KW has made a history of trading away for productive players, so no, I'm not interested in giving up this pick for one year of Fowler or Desmond. Yeah even if they go on to do nothing with their careers, early on in the first few years they still have upside and are trade chips. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 26, 2016 -> 07:03 PM) Here's a list of #27 overall picks. I don't have the last 2, but I think I would trade every single one of them for Dexter Fowler. Porcello could be an exception. The White Sox are really going to have to buck a trend to get impact here, although I do admit, there will be some available: 27th Overall MLB Draft Picks Year Player Pos. Drafted From Drafted By 2013 Phil Ervin OF Samford Cincinnati Reds 2012 Clint Coulter C Union HS (WA) Milwaukee Brewers 2011 Robert Stephenson RHP Alhambra HS (CA) Cincinnati Reds 2010 Jesse Biddle LHP Germantown Frieds HS (PA) Philadelphia Phillies 2009 Michael Franklin SS Lake Brantley HS (Fla.) Seattle Mariners 2008 Carlos Gutierrez RHP University of Miami (Fla.) Minnesota Twins 2007 Rick Porcello RHP Seton Hall (N.J.)Prep Detroit Tigers 2006 Jason Place OF Wren HS Boston Red Sox 2005 Joseph Devine RHP North Carolina St. Atlanta Braves 2004 Taylor Tankersley LHP U Alabama (AL) Florida Marlins 2003 Eric Duncan 3B Seton Hall Prep School (NJ) New York Yankees 2002 Sergio Santos SS Mater Dei HS (CA) Arizona Diamondbacks 2001 Alan Horne P Marianna HS (FL) Cleveland Indians 2000 Robert Stiehl P El Camino College Houston Astros 1999 David Walling P University of Arkansas New York Yankees 1998 Chip Ambres OF West Brook HS (TX) Florida Marlins 1997 Kevin Nicholson SS Stetson University San Diego Padres 1996 A.J. Zapp 1B Center Grove HS (IN) Atlanta Braves 1995 Shea Morenz OF University of Texas New York Yankees 1994 Jacob Shumate P Hartsville HS (SC) Atlanta Braves 1993 Marc Valdes P University of Florida Florida Marlins 1992 John Burke P University of Florida Colorado Rockies 1991 Scott Stahoviak 3B-1B Creighton University Minnesota Twins 1990 Mike Zimmerman P University of South Alabama Pittsburgh Pirates 1989 Todd Jones P Jacksonville State University Houston Astros 1988 Jeff Mutis P Lafayette University Cleveland Indians 1987 Pete Harnisch P Fordham University Baltimore Orioles 1986 Mike Fetters P Pepperdine University California Angels 1985 Bill McGuire C University of Nebraska Seattle Mariners 1984 Gary Green SS Oklahoma State University San Diego Padres 1983 Calvin Schiraldi P University of Texas New York Mets 1982 Stan Boderick OF Robinson HS (Tampa,FL) Chicago Cubs 1981 Kevin Dukes P Arizona State University Seattle Mariners 1980 Jay Tibbs P Huffman HS (AL) New York Mets i don't know how i missed this .... great work in assembling the list. the thing is, every yr the draft is different, and on top of that, 1 draft may be deeper with prospects players, the other yr not so deep. plus many players are signing there contracts the first time around. well the point is, i see the draft starting to get more overall quality ..... or it could be that this and last yr has me a not observing the talent as much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Feb 29, 2016 -> 12:33 AM) Yeah even if they go on to do nothing with their careers, early on in the first few years they still have upside and are trade chips. yeah i agree, i just wish that the system had a deeper core of quality positional players Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 06:01 PM) i don't know how i missed this .... great work in assembling the list. the thing is, every yr the draft is different, and on top of that, 1 draft may be deeper with prospects players, the other yr not so deep. plus many players are signing there contracts the first time around. well the point is, i see the draft starting to get more overall quality ..... or it could be that this and last yr has me a not observing the talent as much. Every draft is different, but this is over 30 of them and not much luck at 27. The good news is the Sox are now at 26 and it is a little better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 29, 2016 -> 12:03 AM) Every draft is different, but this is over 30 of them and not much luck at 27. The good news is the Sox are now at 26 and it is a little better. and i still think this draft, esp with the sox projecting to keep their comp pick, will have some surprise players at #27 or 26. i am really excited on the draft side this yr. this draft if deep, if no one gets hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 06:07 PM) and i still think this draft, esp with the sox projecting to keep their comp pick, will have some surprise players at #27 or 26. i am really excited on the draft side this yr. this draft if deep, if no one gets hurt. There definitely will be someone who will have a great career available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 28, 2016 -> 11:32 AM) btw, what ever happened to the short lived proclamation of, if the admin or mods has a problem, they will PM that poster...... only rules to suit themselves. How many times have we PM'd? LDF, I can tell you the mods don't have it out for people with differing opinions. We are entitled to our opinions as well. People don't get banned/suspended for their opinions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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