Cleveland outdrew us? Attendance down 13% so far

[ewokpelts]

The White Sox are in a terrible position to get a multi-billion dollar t.v. deal at the moment.

 

Obviously, it's three years in the future, but the White Sox are going to be lucky to get something in the same vicinity as the ROOT Sports deal for the Mariners in Seattle.

 

Nobody knows how long the bubble will last with these deals, for one thing. There's lots of concern about the economy going into a period of flat/lower growth, higher interest rates, less corporate profits, credit/loans much harder to come by.

 

Houston had all kinds of problems. Or look at LA, where they overbid by so much and tried to pass the costs onto consumers and none of the service providers were willing to go for it, with so many non-sports fans already cutting the cord (the last time a month or so ago there were attempted re-negotiations they rejected a 30-35% discount from the prior asking price).

 

Point #2 is the Cubs are getting 80% of the attention and that means the lion's share of the marketing/advertising dollars in Chicago. Unless something changes dramatically in that dynamic (the Cubs' current young core) it doesn't make any sense to project a huge tv contract for the White Sox.

 

Where's the profit going to come by paying the White Sox $120 million per season when they haven't made the playoffs (potentially) in over a decade at/by that time? We are well aware how bad the tv and radio ratings have been the last couple of years, in the bottom 3 of the major leagues, if not #30.

 

This assumption that the new tv rights deal is going to "save" the White Sox somehow is pretty ludicrous unless they dramatically change the way they evaluate and procure talent.

bulls***. The Angels have s*** ratings in the overall la market and fox re-upped at 1.5 billion years before the contract was due. The Rangers also got renewed early and were given a signing bonus to stay.

 

The sox are in a large market and are linked to the Bulls and Hawks for the foreseeable Future. AND, most importantly, they own the rights to buy the Cubs share of csn.

 

 

Anyone who thinks the sox are going to get f***ed in a tv deal are smoking battery acid laced crack.

 

[ewokpelts]

Agreed. And when the Cubs announce their own TV station / network that's going to suck up a lot of the advertising dollars.

 

Sully had a column today in the Tribune which has been running a number of stories on the 25 years of U.S. Cellular Field and he had an interesting line in it:

 

"One longtime Sox employee told me Saturday they would have been better off if they had built the ballpark in the suburbs."

 

That's the first time that I know of somebody with the Sox has made a comment like that. Of course they had no choice as Mayor Washington said the ONLY location that he would support (as well as his cronies on the Sports Stadium Authority Board) would be across the street from the original Comiskey Park.)

 

Mark

jim Thompson made a deal with Washington. That's why a chicago hotel tax pays for the state owned stadium bonds.

 

Plus, the sox don't have to leave Comcast. Which already carriage deals with ALL cable providers. Something Jerry MADE Comcast agree to.

 

The Cubs are the ones that have to hope providers want to pay $3 a household for cubsnet

 

[The Mighty Mite]

If I recall correctly the motion lost by one single, solitary vote after the public had its say.

 

Mark

 

The vote in Addison was all Pate's doing, he was a Cub fan and didn't want the Sox in Addison. Here's the thing, when we first moved to DuPage county in 1972, we lived about a mile west of the proposed site in Bloomingdale, it was in an empty field no where near the main population center of Addison. Most of the traffic heading to the park would be from 355 to the south and 290 from the east and the north. From the west fans would have driven on North Ave or Lake street. I'm not even sure the land was in Addison, it was just about a mile south of Medinah Country Club.

Edited May 22, 2016 by The Mighty Mite

[Jose Abreu]

34,000+ in attendance today

[SonofaRoache]

We made the playoffs something like 4 times in 34 years. I'm sure that plays a part in our crappy attendance and ratings. The 2007 team as bad as they were drew 30+ a night because the team was coming off a good run. They need to start having playoff seasons and the fans will come.

[Lip Man 1]

We made the playoffs something like 4 times in 34 years. I'm sure that plays a part in our crappy attendance and ratings. The 2007 team as bad as they were drew 30+ a night because the team was coming off a good run. They need to start having playoff seasons and the fans will come.

 

Correct.

 

And it's five times since 1981 (when JR and EE bought the team) 1983, 1993, 2000, 2005 and 2008.

 

But right now the only teams with a longer post season drought than the Sox are Seattle, Miami and San Diego.

 

That's some company eh?

 

Mark

 

[ewokpelts]

Correct.

 

And it's five times since 1981 (when JR and EE bought the team) 1983, 1993, 2000, 2005 and 2008.

 

But right now the only teams with a longer post season drought than the Sox are Seattle, Miami and San Diego.

 

That's some company eh?

 

Mark

That's deceptive, as the Astros Cubs Mets and blue jays making the playoffs last year made that list much smaller.

And let's not forget that Kansas City and Pittsburgh were on that list together as late as 2012.

[OmarComing25]

Feels like there's an "x playoff appearances in x years" post in almost every thread. We get it, no need to repeat it ad nauseum.

[Panerista]

That's deceptive, as the Astros Cubs Mets and blue jays making the playoffs last year made that list much smaller.

And let's not forget that Kansas City and Pittsburgh were on that list together as late as 2012.

That's not deceptive. It's factual. In today's MLB, the White Sox inability to make the playoffs combined with the inability to build a real minor league system is simply unacceptable.

[Chicago White Sox]

The vote in Addison was all Pate's doing, he was a Cub fan and didn't want the Sox in Addison. Here's the thing, when we first moved to DuPage county in 1972, we lived about a mile west of the proposed site in Bloomingdale, it was in an empty field no where near the main population center of Addison. Most of the traffic heading to the park would be from 355 to the south and 290 from the east and the north. From the west fans would have driven on North Ave or Lake street. I'm not even sure the land was in Addison, it was just about a mile south of Medinah Country Club.

Where the Dave & Buster's is located? I work across the street from Medinah Country Club and can't even begin to think how awesome it would be right now if the Sox were located down the road.

[Black_Jack29]

The Sox drew over 34,500 today. I realize it was Family Sunday with reduced ticket and parking prices and all, but that's still a pretty good sign. Attendance is usually 25,000 or so for the typical mediocre Sox team on a nice day in late May. Being in first place certainly helps.

 

[tray]

Attendance figures at Sox Park is a preoccupation of Cub fans .

 

Wrigley is a stadium that has largely been funded on the backs of those who lost their fortunes and homes to Wall Street during the Bush era economic crash including stock speculators and derivative traders. I would rather have a publicly funded stadium than have a Billionaire bully come in from Omaha and dictate what he thinks is good for the City, for the neighborhood, and for the public.

 

At the end of the day, the joke will be on Ricketts for pouring money into a relatively small piece of urban real estate which is inconvenient to get to, lacks adequate on-site parking, is already congested (even before Clark gets narrowed at Ricketts request) and has no connection to the lakefront other than Gull droppings.

 

If Reinsdorf's sons or a new ownership group (possibly with the Reinsdorfs, Sox fan Rocky Wirtz and others) chooses to relocate, there will be options to relocate to a new ballpark, right on Chicago's Southern lakefront. i.e.,

31st Beach and further South to Promontory Point.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[LittleHurt05]

That's not deceptive. It's factual. In today's MLB, the White Sox inability to make the playoffs combined with the inability to build a real minor league system is simply unacceptable.

 

Having a 1-2 punch capable of stealing a World Series is the worst part about it. Get Sale and Q in the playoffs and let's see what they can do.

[SonofaRoache]

That's deceptive, as the Astros Cubs Mets and blue jays making the playoffs last year made that list much smaller.

And let's not forget that Kansas City and Pittsburgh were on that list together as late as 2012.

 

 

Cubs, Pirates, and Mets are looking like they will be a playoff contender for the next ten years so they no longer apply. KC has played in back to back world series so their arrow pointing upwards takes them off the list.

[The Mighty Mite]

Where the Dave & Buster's is located? I work across the street from Medinah Country Club and can't even begin to think how awesome it would be right now if the Sox were located down the road.

 

We've been in Florida for 23 years so I don't know where Dave and Busters is, the Sox stadium would have been between Swift road and 355 on the east and west, on the north and south it was Lake street and Army Trail road.

 

EDIT. Just did a Street View search and found D & B, the stadium was to be just south of D & B.

Edited May 23, 2016 by The Mighty Mite

[SonofaRoache]

Having a 1-2 punch capable of stealing a World Series is the worst part about it. Get Sale and Q in the playoffs and let's see what they can do.

 

 

I agree with this completely. This is why I'd like for us to try and acquire a legit number 2 pitcher. If you can sneak in you have three pitchers who are dam good and hopefully one of the latter guys would have stepped up to claim the 4th spot. That top 3 or 4 would compete with anybody including the Cubs. On the flip side, we'd probably lose all those games 2 to 1. The Cubs would likely scrap 1 or 2 off Sale and Q but I doubt we could even tough Arrieta and Lester.

[caulfield12]

bulls***. The Angels have s*** ratings in the overall la market and fox re-upped at 1.5 billion years before the contract was due. The Rangers also got renewed early and were given a signing bonus to stay.

 

The sox are in a large market and are linked to the Bulls and Hawks for the foreseeable Future. AND, most importantly, they own the rights to buy the Cubs share of csn.

 

 

Anyone who thinks the sox are going to get f***ed in a tv deal are smoking battery acid laced crack.

 

Yes, but the value of that deal wouldn't have been so high if not for the presence of Trout, one of the two best players in baseball.

 

I get the idea of comparing the "second team" in another large market with two teams to the White Sox situation, but the Angels have been running a Top 5-7 payroll and are always among the Top 10 in attendance in the majors as well.

 

 

In order for the White Sox rights to more than double, who is going to be bidding against CSN for those rights? They're going to rise from $50,000 to $100-120,000 per game based on...? Maintaining a good relationship with the Bulls/Reinsdorf?

 

Realistically, if you were running Comcast and looking at re-negotiating the Sox contract, why would you more than double it? Because they're losing the Cubs, in all likelihood?

 

And what's to say that CSN won't be forced by paying more for the White Sox property to pass those costs on to subscribers? It's not QUITE the same thing as a regional monster like YES or the Red Sox with NESN or the Dodgers, but how can they pay so much more unless they believe they can increase their profits by a similar percentage in terms of ROI?

 

Ultimately, I suppose, JR could threaten to take the White Sox and Bulls TOGETHER to another carrier...but how likely is that to happen? That their rights fees would be mixed together and leveraged as a single entity?

[caulfield12]

I agree with this completely. This is why I'd like for us to try and acquire a legit number 2 pitcher. If you can sneak in you have three pitchers who are dam good and hopefully one of the latter guys would have stepped up to claim the 4th spot. That top 3 or 4 would compete with anybody including the Cubs. On the flip side, we'd probably lose all those games 2 to 1. The Cubs would likely scrap 1 or 2 off Sale and Q but I doubt we could even tough Arrieta and Lester.

 

 

From the White Sox perspective, the only way this happens is through the draft or "stealing" another Quintana/Santos/Jenks/Humber.

 

There's just not the money available to give ANOTHER starter a $100 million + contract...not when it has to spread around the rest of the offense over the next couple of years to keep that line-up competitive.

 

Having ANOTHER frontline starter is a luxury. The White Sox believe Rodon is that guy, anyway, and have to be comfortable with their Top 3. The most important factor, obviously, is just getting into the playoffs in the first place. They obviously hope that Fulmer, Danish, Adams, Guerrero or Jordan Stephens will become that final rotation piece as well.

 

 

 

 

White Sox battling with the Marlins (what the hell happened to Giancarlo Stanton?).

 

26. MIAMI 20629 per game

27. WHITE SOX 20479 per game

 

White Sox have Cincy, Atlanta, Baltimore and Minnesota in front of them. Looks like we're headed for 23rd or 24th in attendance, which would be a big improvement. Don't see them passing the Orioles if Baltimore keeps up their level of play.

 

Current pace is 1.659 million. Hopefully it ends up much closer to 1.8-1.85 million, perhaps 1.9.

[The Beast]

What reasoning do you think Cub fans have about coming to the Cell to see a game? I swear, whenever I go to the ballpark I see a Cub fan. I think it's that they enjoy baseball and that the Cubs are out of town, but I don't understand why they go to the Sox games. I think, I'd never wear my Sox stuff to Wrigley unless it's the Sox playing the Cubs.

 

34,000 people is pretty sweet, I hope attendance can stay up and they climb to at least 23rd in the standings. Apparently Ventura was disappointed in the attendance at Sale's last outing.

[tray]

Cub fans from the the South side lack brain cells so it is hard to imagine that they employ much logic when they decide to attend a Sox game and wear their ridiculous looking Cub attire.

[SonofaRoache]

From the White Sox perspective, the only way this happens is through the draft or "stealing" another Quintana/Santos/Jenks/Humber.

 

There's just not the money available to give ANOTHER starter a $100 million + contract...not when it has to spread around the rest of the offense over the next couple of years to keep that line-up competitive.

 

Having ANOTHER frontline starter is a luxury. The White Sox believe Rodon is that guy, anyway, and have to be comfortable with their Top 3. The most important factor, obviously, is just getting into the playoffs in the first place. They obviously hope that Fulmer, Danish, Adams, Guerrero or Jordan Stephens will become that final rotation piece as well.

 

 

 

 

White Sox battling with the Marlins (what the hell happened to Giancarlo Stanton?).

 

26. MIAMI 20629 per game

27. WHITE SOX 20479 per game

 

White Sox have Cincy, Atlanta, Baltimore and Minnesota in front of them. Looks like we're headed for 23rd or 24th in attendance, which would be a big improvement. Don't see them passing the Orioles if Baltimore keeps up their level of play.

 

Current pace is 1.659 million. Hopefully it ends up much closer to 1.8-1.85 million, perhaps 1.9.

 

This is true but I think we can get a low end number two guy who for a rental later in the year even. They have a two year window to steal a pennant and get the ball rolling as these high draft picks turn into starters.

[southsider2k5]

This is true but I think we can get a low end number two guy who for a rental later in the year even. They have a two year window to steal a pennant and get the ball rolling as these high draft picks turn into starters.

 

Who?

[Panerista]

Cub fans from the the South side lack brain cells so it is hard to imagine that they employ much logic when they decide to attend a Sox game and wear their ridiculous looking Cub attire.

 

 

Some of the brightest people I know are Cubs fans. They're the Blackhawks fans of baseball. They show up to the wrong games in the wrong apparel. Albeit, Cubs fans are generally more intelligent than Blackhawks fans.

Edited May 23, 2016 by Deadpool

[caulfield12]

This is true but I think we can get a low end number two guy who for a rental later in the year even. They have a two year window to steal a pennant and get the ball rolling as these high draft picks turn into starters.

 

It seems there are going to be two camps.

 

The few aces on the market, like Sonny Gray, potentially...that would be well beyond our grasp prospect-wise.

 

Then those guys like Cashner, Shields, Erwin Santana, Teheran, Ricky Nolasco...that are probably closer to 4's or even 5's and have "bad" contracts and/or are getting more expensive on teams going nowhere.

 

Rich Hill is a perfect example of someone who statistically might look like a 2/3 in Oakland, but teams would be foolish overpaying for in hopes of landing a legit 2 (let's call him "lower tier" 2).

[Dunt]

What reasoning do you think Cub fans have about coming to the Cell to see a game? I swear, whenever I go to the ballpark I see a Cub fan. I think it's that they enjoy baseball and that the Cubs are out of town, but I don't understand why they go to the Sox games. I think, I'd never wear my Sox stuff to Wrigley unless it's the Sox playing the Cubs.

 

34,000 people is pretty sweet, I hope attendance can stay up and they climb to at least 23rd in the standings. Apparently Ventura was disappointed in the attendance at Sale's last outing.

 

Dude. Every f***ing game I've been to this year. Either they are retarded or this is some really odd complex. I'd never be caught dead at Wrigley if the Sox weren't there and I sure as hell wouldn't wear all Sox gear if I did. I've seen so many Cubs fans at the Cell this year.