harkness99 Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 (edited) It's early... but this team looks exactly the team I recognized the last 4 years under Hahn/Ventura. Lifeless offense and a bury your head in the sand conclusion at the end. This feels way way too familiar. Edited May 21, 2016 by harkness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 (edited) 2012 was fun until that 4-11 finish. It was totally unexpected. 11 rookie pitchers. Q became a stud from out of nowhere. For 2-3 weeks, Youkilis looked like he had rediscovered the fountain of youth. Breath of fresh air with Ozzie's drama gone. Wonder if Greg backed up his talk by betting his house on the Royals these first two games? That would have been ballsy. Ventura/Rodon would have been the most logical one entering the series to wager on. Edited May 21, 2016 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 QUOTE (harkness @ May 21, 2016 -> 03:30 PM) It's early... but this team looks exactly the team I recognized the last 4 years under Hahn/Ventura. Lifeless offense and a bury your head in the sand conclusion at the end. This feels way way too familiar. It's the scouting. While the Sox may have good luck finding young pitching, everything else in the scouting department is beyond terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaconOnAStick Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 The new clubhouse energy really did a lot to put that 8th inning in Texas behind them. How many players on this team have ever played for an over .500 club? Melky and Robertson? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 Way to ruin a 23-10 record in a hurry. 2-8 better be a blip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 I keep saying they need to be 42-28 on June 19, but now it wouldn't shock me if they go 10-17 the next 27 and be back to .500 going to Boston. We'll see. This stretch absolutely blows if they're playing bad baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panerista Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 QUOTE (flavum @ May 21, 2016 -> 04:56 PM) Way to ruin a 23-10 record in a hurry. 2-8 better be a blip. I'm concerned it's an adjustment. I just don't know how bad the team is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 QUOTE (kitekrazy @ May 21, 2016 -> 10:39 PM) It's the scouting. While the Sox may have good luck finding young pitching, everything else in the scouting department is beyond terrible. Amen, brother. Scouting blows. QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ May 21, 2016 -> 10:52 PM) The new clubhouse energy really did a lot to put that 8th inning in Texas behind them. How many players on this team have ever played for an over .500 club? Melky and Robertson? Amen, brother. As a fan is it asking too much to shake off a loss like that and bounce back quickly? Thanks White Sox for predictably going in the tank after the almighty Robin/Scott Carroll choke job. Way to pick up your manager, Lawrie, Frazier, Rollins, even Abreu and Melky and Avila. Pathetic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerksticks Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 At least the corpses of the late 2000's hit homers sometimes. Outside of 2006, Thome was one of the worst things to ever happen to the white sox. Konerko, Thome & Dye had zero wheels. Needed three hits to score Thome. This is a different version of suckball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panerista Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 QUOTE (Jerksticks @ May 21, 2016 -> 06:09 PM) At least the corpses of the late 2000's hit homers sometimes. Outside of 2006, Thome was one of the worst things to ever happen to the white sox. Konerko, Thome & Dye had zero wheels. Needed three hits to score Thome. This is a different version of suckball. You can't be serious. He was almost as good in 2007 as he was in 2006. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winninguglyin83 Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 Anderson not in the lineup at Charlotte tonight. Maybe ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 QUOTE (Deadpool @ May 22, 2016 -> 12:22 AM) You can't be serious. He was almost as good in 2007 as he was in 2006. Amazing how Crede is thought of as an all-time great and thome is brushed aside Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harkness99 Posted May 21, 2016 Author Share Posted May 21, 2016 QUOTE (Jerksticks @ May 21, 2016 -> 06:09 PM) At least the corpses of the late 2000's hit homers sometimes. Outside of 2006, Thome was one of the worst things to ever happen to the white sox. Konerko, Thome & Dye had zero wheels. Needed three hits to score Thome. This is a different version of suckball. I'm talking about the last 4 years... back in previous years yeah we could hit the ball out of the park. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panerista Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (fathom @ May 21, 2016 -> 06:23 PM) Amazing how Crede is thought of as an all-time great and thome is brushed aside Which is crazy because everyone here values locker room guys. Jim Thome may be the classiest guy in MLB history. And Joe Crede had 1 year with a better WAR than Jim Thome in 2007. Edited May 21, 2016 by Deadpool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerksticks Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 QUOTE (fathom @ May 21, 2016 -> 06:23 PM) Amazing how Crede is thought of as an all-time great and thome is brushed aside Agree with the Crede. After 06 I identified Thome as the entire problem with the White Sox. He was brutal to watch IMO. I know he somehow got on base, but he made me want to create a whole new statistic to send into fangraphs: POBP- Pointless On Base Percentage. Or OBP that doesn't help a team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harkness99 Posted May 21, 2016 Author Share Posted May 21, 2016 I'd take Jim Thome right now.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDWhiteSoxFan Posted May 21, 2016 Share Posted May 21, 2016 I've been trying to keep my head up about the team. The hot start was awesome. The fact that we are 2-9 the last 11 only winning Sales starts really drags me down. We are now in for a long season unless something drastically changes starting tomorrow. We hit when our pitchers are shelled and when they go out and only give up 2 or 3 runs we do nothing at the plate. It's frustrating, we are wasting the best pitcher in AL's prime years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 When I was at the ballgame today I almost wondered if Hahn should eventually consider trading Sale to get a kings ransom while they still can. If they did that it would signal a white flag for several more years but at least they would have some more talent at different positions. I look at this club and I see weaknesses at catcher, starting pitcher, relief pitching and temporary weaknesses at second base, first base and center field. Maybe some starters and relievers are in a funk, but they definitely need some more positional talent up here. I hope that the almost 23 million that is going to be off the books for LaRoche and Danks next year will allow them to sign some more free agents, but I would prefer that the Sox organization would scout better and get more than just pitching each year. If they suck at picking positional talent, why not trade with teams like the Northsiders that have a surplus of positional talent and don't have as good of pitching in the farm system? I definitely think Abreu, Frazier, Lawrie, Avila/Navarro, Rollins and Jackson need to step up. It's not good when Abreu can't get guys in with no outs and the bases loaded and Sands, a AAAA player gets a hit. I know that baseball is streaky, but these guys really need to improve from tomorrow going forward if they want to stay in this thing. I don't think getting someone like Ryan Braun (some rumor the other day talked about him...where would he play?) would be necessary to trade the farm for this year either. It's just time for guys to start hitting and everyone being more consistent in order to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 (edited) Braun would take Cabrera's place sometimes and Avi's place sometimes at DH. I don't see the White Sox taking on that contract though, especially adding another former PEDs guy to go along with Melky. http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/03/2016...ree-agents.html It's a HORRIFIC market coming up, especially for outfielders and pitchers. If there's one certainty about their current predicament, it's that offseason FA fixes won't do it...and the farm system, almost 2 months in, is bereft of new prospects who can contribute for next year in Chicago. Unless you're confident in Nicky Delmonico and Danny Hayes (obviously there's Anderson, maybe Fulmer or Danish). And about half of that $23 million is getting eaten up by automatic raises/salary escalators...not to mention arbitration for guys like Avi, Lawrie and Abreu, assuming they're all still with the club. Frazier will be more expensive, too. Edited May 22, 2016 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 The only players that appeal to me are: Kenley Jansen Gio Gonzalez Carlos Santana Josh Reddick Colby Rasmus Ian Desmond Matt Wieters Wilson Ramos I don't know much about the minor league system that we have but I hope that at least one or two of the guys you've mentioned can come in and contribute. I don't regret trading Thompson to get Frazier either - they needed smeone to play third that didn't suck. Who knows what will happen, I just hope they draft better, play better and get better overall. Otherwise, we'll have to hope they sell the team when JR passes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 QUOTE (SpankyEaton @ May 21, 2016 -> 06:47 PM) The only players that appeal to me are: Kenley Jansen Gio Gonzalez Carlos Santana Josh Reddick Colby Rasmus Ian Desmond Matt Wieters Wilson Ramos I don't know much about the minor league system that we have but I hope that at least one or two of the guys you've mentioned can come in and contribute. I don't regret trading Thompson to get Frazier either - they needed smeone to play third that didn't suck. Who knows what will happen, I just hope they draft better, play better and get better overall. Otherwise, we'll have to hope they sell the team when JR passes. Ramos might be the only one (along with Jansen) you can get for less than $50 million on a 3 year contract. With Robertson's presence for another two seasons, hard to imagine they'd invest another $10-12 million per season on a reliever with all the other positional holes. Santana probably will have his option picked up for 2017, especially if the Indians make the post-season. Bringing back Gio a 3rd time would be pretty humorous...and result in a Shark-like season in the AL. It does go to show how hard it is to find catching solutions that are not just band-aids. Even someone like Francisco Cervelli is earning over $10 million per season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 Yes, yes it is. Failure has many fathers but this one is mostly on Abreu and Jackson right now. They have been a couple of the worst regulars in MLB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swingandalongonetoleft Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 (edited) The series in Texas (more specifically, the 8th inning of the 13-11 loss) was as profound a face-plant as I could imagine. If you're an offense that puts up 11 runs going into the bottom of the 8th (up 11-6), only to watch your bullpen fail as utterly as they did- 7 runs, a blown lead, and on top of that, you only have 3 measly outs for any sort of rebuttal once that half inning comes to a merciful end- it's no surprise that things haven't felt right since. The White Sox bullpen ambushed the White Sox that night. Edited May 22, 2016 by Swingandalongonetoleft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 QUOTE (Swingandalongonetoleft @ May 21, 2016 -> 08:42 PM) The series in Texas (more specifically, the 8th inning of the 13-11 loss) was as profound a face-plant as I could imagine. If you're an offense that puts up 11 runs going into the bottom of the 8th (up 11-6), only to watch your bullpen fail as utterly as they did- 7 runs and a blown lead and you get 3 measly outs for any sort of rebuttal it after that half inning comes to a merciful end, it's no surprise that things haven't felt right since. The White Sox bullpen ambushed the White Sox that night. One game can completely turn a season around one way or the other...I've seen it happen before especially if it impacts the players mentally. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 (edited) The Jose Paniagua game in 2003 (even though they barely held on in the end and actually won) was the turning point for sure in that season with the Twins...along with the Burke/Torii Hunter takedown. 2010, Thome's homer off Matt Thornton. 2005, Sizemore dropping that ball in KC and Riske giving up the homer to Crede Edited May 22, 2016 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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