soxforlife05 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 QUOTE (greg775 @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 04:08 PM) This is why you don't hire former players. First Ozzie canned and hated forever; now Robin. I do agree Robin must go, but it also is sad. I can't hate any manager who won a world series for the Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 05:53 PM) I can't hate any manager who won a world series for the Sox. I can't hate ozzie but he's dead to me after the way he quit on the team. I thank him for his contributions as a player and manager but he can f*** off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 05:39 PM) We'll be getting the RV firing soon. Front office however is staying the same I'm ashamed to say. I do wish Hahn had full reigns to see what he'd be about. I do think he's hamstrung by KW at times. That may be the case. At one time, I thought it was the case. Now I really don't know. I like what Hahn did his fist year...try to build a foundation (which was exactly 2 when he took over: Q and Sale). In a 6 month time period, he doubled it to 4 (Abreu and Eaton) with Avi and Davidson as possibilities. But then, he, or Williams or both decided to "Go for it" and that was that. Edited June 14, 2016 by GreenSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalSox Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 02:49 PM) Terry Boers never really breaks news but he just casually said that Ventura is toast this week with a bad series vs Detroit. It really does finally have that feel. Lots of smoke about it from radio guys, bloggers, etc. Define bad? 2 of 3 or a sweep? That's what makes me not get too excited. So many factors & overall very subjective when using the term "bad". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YonderLaroche Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 (edited) If Sox get swept he's gone. But so is the season. Losing this series 2/3 keeps him and it's same bulls*** for a few more weeks. Sox haven't won a series in over a month and half, they're toast. I can see us getting swept and hopefully hit rock bottom where big changes are made Edited June 14, 2016 by b-Rye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Shields is doing his part to get Robin fired. And if he keeps this up, he might get Hahn fired too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saufley Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 07:34 PM) Shields is doing his part to get Robin fired. And if he keeps this up, he might get Hahn fired too. What if Hahn and Ventura get fired and Kenny takes over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchetman Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (Saufley @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 07:54 PM) What if Hahn and Ventura get fired and Kenny takes over. I'd love to see Kenny manage the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black_Jack29 Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (Hatchetman @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 07:00 PM) I'd love to see Kenny manage the team. It'd be worth the price of admission to see Kenny take Sale out of a game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad Bosley Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 03:41 PM) People like me? You know nothing about me. Don't get pissed at fans for not being fair weather fans. Trust me, I want the Sox to do well as much as you do - but I don't think boycotting them is going to make any difference, and I assure you that JR wants to win as much as anyone does (as he shows over and over and over again). Is this organization run perfectly? Absolutely not, but one of the reasons I love them so much is they always try, and frankly, while maybe it should have bit them in the ass pretty bad now, it really hasn't at all (speaking last 15-20 years). Evidence? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 08:34 PM) Shields is doing his part to get Robin fired. And if he keeps this up, he might get Hahn fired too. Actually you can't blame Robin or even Coop for Shields. You have to solely blame Hahn or Kenny for bringing him in. Now it is obvious why the Red Sox backed away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Shields has to be tipping something. Having seen a whole of truly bad pitchers in my lifetime, he is getting hit like everyone knows what is coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Fireworks Man Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 07:40 PM) Shields has to be tipping something. Having seen a whole of truly bad pitchers in my lifetime, he is getting hit like everyone knows what is coming. Maybe Dionner will fix him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Here's what I have for Robin's mistakes today- -Starting Garcia in RF, which led to him making 3-4 horrible plays -DHing Coats... I mean, yikes -Putting a mediocre AA pitcher in Tyler Danish in what was then a 1 run game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted June 14, 2016 Author Share Posted June 14, 2016 No coincidence that the only point we were winning today, the team was being managed by Renteria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 11:47 PM) No coincidence that the only point we were winning today, the team was being managed by Renteria. So very true! Excellent in-game management when he took the reigns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigHurt3515 Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Camp Renteria!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigsoxhurt35 Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 09:41 PM) Here's what I have for Robin's mistakes today- -Starting Garcia in RF, which led to him making 3-4 horrible plays -DHing Coats... I mean, yikes -Putting a mediocre AA pitcher in Tyler Danish in what was then a 1 run game Nailed it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Camp Renteria/Cora Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swingandalongonetoleft Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Just random way past bedtime thoughts- would this organization (rather than outright firing the manager) pull something wacky like having him "temporarily step away/take a leave" with no intention of returning as a way to lessen the mess? It would be clumsy as hell, but what's up and what's down with this FO anymore? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (Swingandalongonetoleft @ Jun 14, 2016 -> 01:09 AM) Just random way past bedtime thoughts- would this organization (rather than outright firing the manager) pull something wacky like having him "temporarily step away/take a leave" with no intention of returning as a way to lessen the mess? It would be clumsy as hell, but what's up and what's down with this FO anymore? No. The White Sox, as much as they are a team that we love, are still a business, and unless it were a medical leave (or something Ventura agreed to, which would be a sabbatical without pay, which, no), then they would never be able to do this. It would also create a dichotomy between Ventura and Renteria or Cooper or me or whoever as to who was in charge of the clubhouse. That would not solve a thing and would create more problems than it solves. Also, it would solve no problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Why are so many of you so short-sited and illogical. Clammor for minor league talent but write off guys after like 4 at bats (the Jason Coats hate is so abusrd). As is the Shuck and every other last guy on the bench talk. Idiotic. Tim Anderson will struggle too...its baseball and very few guys are Mike Trout and Bryce Harper. Anderson is going to have a run of errors and mental issues that will be natural for someone his age (who is still pretty raw) and I'm sure we'll see him struggle at some point during this call up (probably sooner vs. later but especially after people get a better look at him and pitchers start to adjust). Unfortunately, outside of Gordon Beckham, in many cases the White Sox front office's patience for young players has been about as short-sited as well, this boards. Unless you come up and are immediately awesome (see Sale / Q / Rodon), you are kind of kicked to the curb / cast immediate judgement on (this being overly blunt as there is a fine line here, but in general, I feel for as aggressive as we are at moving players up, we are not willing to actually be patient. Yes, I think most stars have something about them that they'll succeed regardless, but for quality low cost solid players, I think patience can often be the name of the game, and it is those type of players we can miss out on because of our impatience. This team was going to have to have everything go right to be a 90 win team (I think most of us said that from the beginning) and a lot of us pegged this as a team that would hover around .500, +/- a few games and with a few good bounces could be a playoff team (especially if they bought at the deadline). You compound that with all the injuries to the pen and now Jackson, plus Abreu being awful, and well, we shouldn't be surprised we are where we are. Of course we have played really really awful more recently, but given what made up 2/5th's of our rotation to start the season (Danks / Latos), again, I'd have expected some ugly issues given Rodon would have his inconsistencies (young pitchers with control problems, but above average stuff typically do) and than it would just take some offensive slumps or the random down game from Sale / Q and you'd see some extended losing streaks. I'd actually say one of the most dissapointing parts of the season is Todd Frazier. He is a continued trend of players we acquire who get worse vs. better. That said, hopefully he can make some adjustments to the league and have a more consistent 2nd half (yes, he's hit a lot of homers, but outside of that he's been pretty blah). Abreu clearly was a dissapointment as well, but honestly, I'm probably missing something, but those are about the only two guys who have underperformed significantly vs. expectations (and i know people will argue with me on Frazier, but I fundamentally am opposed to players whose only asset is power (thankfully he brings average defense) and right now that is Frazier's only asset. PS: I never said Jason Coats was some phenom and I'm not proposing starting him (he's most likely a bench player at best), but I do think that if you are going to promote and demote and reach judgement on guys based upon extremely limited at bats, well, most every single prospect you ever see will be a colossal failure. Also, as you know, I'm fine changing managers because it is a card available in a win or get fired season anyway for Robin (who I presume knew those were the expectations going into things). I think at the very least, you know if this team struggles, Robin doesn't get another year, so you might as well see if a change somehow helps light a spark (could or couldn't and like I said about, I don't really think this is much more than a mediocre to slightly above mediocre team when healthy. I will also continue to predict that Erik Johnson pitches better over the next 3 years than Shields. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Injuries are not an excuse for this team. If you want to point to non-performance, it's clearly Abreu (until the last couple of weeks), Rodon and more recently Frazier. This team was put on the field with a razor-thin margin of error, because of Avi (plus the LaRoche "situation"), the back end of the rotation (they actually got about what was expected from Latos, to be honest) and the financial issues (or lack of willingness to give up a draft pick) that led to a number of "value" signings, some which have worked out "okay" like Austin Jackson but none have solved or addressed long-term issues with this team. Basically, those "long term" issues have just been punted down the road into the future, not unlike our national debt. We're doing the same exact thing now taking on the Shields contract (when it wasn't even completely necessary) and also pushing up Anderson to the majors quite quickly. Then, because we're in "desperation mode" now to stay in the race, we have to pull the plug on playing Saladino or Coats or Sanchez or basically anyone (see Micah Johnson early 2015 or Marcus Semien early 2014) for more than 2-3 years if they don't contribute something positively almost right off the bat. We take guys who are obviously not ready for prime time like Tyler Danish and Kahnle and just throw them into the fire and are seemingly surprised when those moves don't work. On the other hand, we stubbornly hold onto "suspects" like Coats and JB Shuck because we can't develop any legit alternatives in our minor league system. It's pretty clear the writing is already on the wall with Coats, and that's a sad thing...because he busted his ass to become at least a possible future regular and he's just not getting a chance, because the White Sox just don't have enough confidence or trust in his ability to deliver. But they trust in Avi? And guys like Beckham and Viciedo in the past to turn things around....based on what? Money invested in them? Prospect ratings? The fact that Avi HAS to succeed to justify the wisdom of a past trade, or the fact that Iglesias has become a regular for the Tigers and Montas might become a significant contributor to the Dodgers at some point this season? I just hate that Garcia bought himself another 2-3 weeks in the line-up because of last night. It's better than a loss, but to expect some kind of turnaround in his offensive approach or defense at this point is foolish and short-sighted. And now we're betting our season on Justin Morneau returning to 2014 form on a $1 million "make good" contract? It's almost comical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jun 13, 2016 -> 11:47 PM) No coincidence that the only point we were winning today, the team was being managed by Renteria. We scored the first 7 runs when Ventura was there, FWIW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB2.0 Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Could've been 8 if Robin had sent Anderson in the 6th against that righty and Saltalamacchia with his 25% CS rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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